On Thu, 28 Jul 2016 10:33:50 -0600, Chris Murphy wrote: > On Thu, Jul 28, 2016 at 2:31 AM, Alexander Bisogiannis > <alexixor@xxxxxxxxx> wrote: >> On 28/07/16 00:13, Chris Murphy wrote: > >>> That's nonsense. You're basically saying leveraging hardware features >>> is persona non grata, everyone should just accept mediocre power >>> management, which is precisely what we already have in even the best >>> case let alone the worst case, compared to smart phones. Of course >>> this should be better, and of course it should involve the user far >>> less than it does. >> >> >> We are comparing smart phones to laptops now? >> Why does a DE for desktops and laptops compare it self with a smart >> phone? > > Connected Standby / InstantGo is precisely making that comparison, is an > attempt to get the benefits of mobile power management onto laptops. > > > >>> I don't understand this desire to manually futz with things, except >>> that it suggests the automatic thing isn't working correctly, in which >>> case it's a bug that should be fixed. But an option to manually do >>> things just because, that's not convincing to me at all. There are all >>> kinds of power managements events that are happening in firmware that >>> you have no control over, and wouldn't want control over. >>> >>> >>> >> I don't understand why functionality was removed before the new >> functionality was ready. > > I don't follow what's been recently removed. If it's a comparison going > back to the pleistocene, some way to separately control brightness on > battery vs AC, I don't see that as a hill worth dying on. > >> You are arguing for something that is not possible yet in Linux, but >> you have removed the previous UI nevertheless? > > No I'm arguing for things that exist in other distros, e.g. powertop (or > tuned if that works better, I haven't used it), and hibernation being > supported out of the box. > > I think it's great there's an effort to bring discrete/integrated GPU > graphics switching into Fedora. For the hardware that defaults to the > discrete GPU being on, that'll certainly improve battery life. > > >> I am sorry but the real Linux desktop, the one that people pay real >> money for, includes tweakUI, a poweroff button, screen brightness UI >> etc. > > *shrug* I'm not seeing a noteworthy deficiency in this area. The biggest > related issue(s) I have is, automatic brightness (enabled by default and > I can and have disabled it) has a couple edge cases where the built-in > display is turned off like on log out, and goes to maximum brightness at > other times, it's nearly the opposite of what I'd expect, and haven't > been able to figure out what the pattern even is, so I've turned it off. > However, even off, something is still sensing what action to take, and > it's spamming the journal, since that's consistent I did file a bug > about that. https://bugzilla.redhat.com/show_bug.cgi?id=1359481 > > > >> You might argue all day about non issues that become issues because of >> your opinion, but the fact is that there is *no* way that a paying >> customer would tolerate a system where they could not control the >> above. > > The only thing in your list I don't have, and don't miss, is tweakUI. So > I suspect you're wrong that I wouldn't tolerate this in a payed for OS. > I happen to use such OS's and I can assure you that people routinely pay > for having LESS features (called clutter). More visible functionality is > not inherently good, it can be bad, in fact it can make something > completely mindnumbing and irritating as hell to use. > > > >> You will say of course that this is fedora not RHEL, but the fact is >> that Gnome3 as shipped with RHEL has reversed every single one of the >> above decisions. >> >> So next time, when *a lot* of people complain you should listen, else >> the paying people will complain and then there will be problems. > > Well I think we're off the rails because so far there's one person > complaining about the loss of separate brightness adjustment when on > battery and when on power, compared to a reported much larger volume of > users who didn't like the behavior. > > > > -- > Chris Murphy I am really sorry for derailing the thread. I misunderstood. I thought we were talking about removing the brightness control altogether and rely on auto brightness based in the light sensor! Again I am sorry. Abis -- desktop mailing list desktop@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx https://lists.fedoraproject.org/admin/lists/desktop@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
