Tony Marston wrote:
"Stut" <stuttle@xxxxxxxxx> wrote in message
news:480DF7B8.1080302@xxxxxxxxxxxx
Tony Marston wrote:
""Jay Blanchard"" <jblanchard@xxxxxxxxxx> wrote in message
news:9F6B7518E92167499E0168D01C2D8D9C4174E9@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
[snip]
If you don't use a framework then obviously you are writing nothing but
mickey mouse programs, and wouldn't stand a chance when it comes to
writing a proper application.
......If you think you can achieve the same
level of productivity WITHOUT a framework then you are living in cloud
\cuckoo land.
\[/snip]
Tony is obviously joking here folks.
No I'm not.
Shocking and unexpected opinion from the developer of a framework. NOT!
Anyway, I can see this falling into another lengthy discussion so I'll get
my contribution in early to avoid disappointment.
As others have mentioned this question is plagued by semantic arguments.
To me a framework is as much about the way requests are routed and handled
as it is about utility code.
I don't use what I would call a framework, but I do have a
well-established file layout for my sites and an extensive library of code
that covers everything I need to do regularly.
This could be classed as a framework as it obviously provides the means to
make use of all that code which has already been written and therefore does
not (or should not) need to be written again and again. As well as providing
a few low-level routines a fully fledged framework will also provide a
series of high-level functions such as user authentication, role based
access control, dynamic menus, audit logging and perhaps a workflow system.
Not to me, that would be a code library. A framework is something that
would tie it all together and in doing so would introduce certain rules
and restrictions.
The real measure of a good framework is the length of time it takes to
create a new database table, then write the components to maintain the
contents of that table. I can do this in 5 minutes without having to write a
single line of PHP, HTML or SQL. If you can't match this then you're not in
the same league.
If that's your attitude I'm very happy to be in a different league. I
tend not to measure my productivity by how quickly I can develop
functionality, but rather on how well it runs, scales and how
user-friendly it is. I'm yet to meet a "framework" that satisfies those
requirements.
This is a personal preference and your arrogance has definitely put me
off ever going near your code whether it be a framework or a hello
world. You are not better than me just because you use something you
call a framework, and the fact that you think you are has given me my
biggest chuckle of the day, so thanks for that.
-Stut
--
http://stut.net/
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