On Sat, Mar 03, 2018 at 05:12:27PM -0600, Mary B wrote: > I also personally don't think we should have turned this so directly into a > women's issue. It's a little bit of a red herring to turn this into the > notion that something like this will help us with the diversity issue, in > particular in light of the fact that women are not not coming to IETF > because of photographs, there are other social interaction issues that are > more of a problem and some of those have been highlighted in this thread. Given all my criticism on the photography policy as its suggested so far, at least its a lot more productive trying to figure out what can usefully be done to IETF more attactive to a diverse attendeeship - insted of the often seen & lazy "we just ned to raise quota for minority xyz". Of course, the latter one is often done because its easier. The primary issue IMHO wrt. photography is the conflict between safety and the need for IETF work to have a clear public, transparent core. Which IMHO we have not well defined. IMHO, one needs to be as transparent in-person as one is on ietf mailing list email discussions. And that just difficult to do without relying on the likeness of people in these in-person meetings. I wish we would have made more advancements such as RFID chips on badges with an email-address. And automatic reading of those RFID chips when approaching the microphone. Would save my life as a scripe every time. If we had that, then for all i care, everybody in the IETF could run around wearing paper bags over their head for safety and to take peoples faces out of the picture for IETF work (the paper bag over the head was Van Jacobsons mug shot back in the 90ths, when AFAIK, we first had a mug-shot photo collection ;-). > Also, if you go back to the hackathon thread that seemed to trigger this > whole thing, it wasn't about being photographed or not, but rather someone > did not want their badge with their name in the picture. They didn't ask > for their picture to be redacted but rather be replaced with one not > showing the badge. So, I think this is going a bit too far, but again > I'll be very happy to be labeled as "don't photograph me" at meetings. See above. The correct IETF solution IMHO of course would have been for the photo to only show the badges, and everyone who wanted their likeness protected should have worn a paper bag over their head. Google can map back head shots to names, so its somewhat silly not to provide the mapping. But i can't. What do i care about the look of faces i do not know and can therefore not get back to on an IETF mailing list ?? > But, while we're on the topic of mirroring policies of other organizations, I think we should be on the topic of NOT DOING that, but at best use it as ideas that should be vetted but not taken as final truth without an IETF specific analysis. [change of subject below, cut mail, restart with new subject]
