First let me say that I don't care what guidelines we use for posting to
the list; I think Jay's original message was probably reasonable to
post. I was simply responding to Andy's comment that his message
"certainly fits" the description of the list; it's not "certain", and
certainly not to the unnamed person who commented to Jay that it didn't.
All I meant was that we should have a real discussion about whether or
not it fit and write down our conclusion somewhere so that we don't need
to have this discussion again.
That said:
On 7 May 2021, at 18:48, S Moonesamy wrote:
The burden is on the person complaining about a message to explain why
it is not okay.
On 8 May 2021, at 6:38, Carsten Bormann wrote:
(And, as usual, the detection of this as a charter violation created
an order of magnitude more noise than the pointer itself.)
Using words like "burden" and "charter violation" isn't helpful and
makes this sound like some sort of legal exercise. There are no burdens
of proof here; we're trying to be polite to one another and have some
guidelines to help people do that.
On 2021-05-07, at 17:26, Pete Resnick <resnick@xxxxxxxxxxxx> wrote:
But it doesn't fit the IETF list charter, RFC 3005:
Inappropriate postings include:
- Announcements of conferences, events, or activities that are not
sponsored or endorsed by the Internet Society or IETF.
The English I learned doesn’t make an announcement of the form
“here are people offering money so you can continue your IETF
work” an "Announcement of conferences, events, or activities”.
The main page that Jay pointed to looks to me, at least at first glance,
to be an announcement of an activity not sponsored or endorsed by ISOC
or the IETF. In this case, it sounds like one that it would be good for
IETF folks to know about, and we might agree ones like this in the
future should not be looked sideways at. Are we OK with all Internet
technology grant announcements on this list? What about job
opportunities?
Again, I'm only suggesting it's a good idea to come to some agreement
about what's reasonable and what's not.
Maybe me announcing that I wrote another version of some piece of
software that implements IETF protocols and plan to continue doing
that, does, much more so, but nobody would complain about that.
If it had instructions about how to buy the latest version, perhaps with
an "IETF Member Discount", and pointers to your other wonderful products
available on your website, I bet you would get complaints. :-)
“Considerable latitude”, as Amelia said…
I'm all for it. So let's just decide what's reasonable and what's not.
pr
--
Pete Resnick https://www.episteme.net/
All connections to the world are tenuous at best
