What do you mean by 'packages from clean 3.2007 and 4.2007 installations'? Are you still speaking about extras repository? >From my point of view first step would be to make clear package acceptance criteria for extras. The next step is to select well tested and widely used by community and users applications which met this criteria and put them into extras. On Sat, 2007-07-21 at 12:51 +0400, ext DZ wrote: > So, the first experiment can be is to adopt packages for 4.2007.26-8 make > 'em a base for earlier platforms dist-upgrade. Initially the list of > packages from clean 3.2007 and 4.2007 installations should be created for > analysis of the difference. Am I right? > > Denis > > On Fri, 20 Jul 2007 17:37:26 +0400, Ed Bartosh <eduard.bartosh at nokia.com> > wrote: > > > On Fri, 2007-07-20 at 15:12 +0300, Tomas Junnonen wrote: > >> Ed Bartosh wrote: > >> >> I think at least partially it's because there's no carrot being > >> offered > >> >> to the developers. If the Extras repository was included in the > >> >> Application Manager by default, although disabled (as Multiverse is > >> in > >> >> Ubuntu, you can show a disclaimer when enabling it), people would be > >> >> more likely to upload to it: > >> >> > >> >> - It creates awareness of the repository. Outside this mailing list > >> few > >> >> developers are likely to even know of the existence of this > >> repository. > >> >> If the repository is visible in the manager you can Google for > >> >> instructions on how to get your own software there. > >> >> > >> > I'd look at it from community point of view. If we want to have one > >> more > >> > line in /etc/sources.list or in some other configuration file why we > >> > should wait for Nokia to do that? Is it so hard to make some package > >> for > >> > this and put its .install file somewhere on garage? > >> > >> Defaults matter. By enabling extras through an install file on garage > >> you're limiting yourself to the hardcore crowd who knows to visit garage > >> in the first place. > >> > > I agree with this. But considering the fact that we already have more > > than 3,5 thousands registered garage users it's not bad to start with > > them just to prove the concept. > > Of course it's much harder than just sitting and blaming Nokia :) > > > >> That's not to say the community couldn't step up to make extras The Repo > >> right now without Nokia's help. I'm just saying the incentive for doing > >> so is weak at the moment. > > > >> > >> > What I mean is that nothing prevents community to make it 'the repo'. > >> > The only two things are missing: clear criteria to get there and team > >> of > >> > uploaders or even one uploader. Then if it works it can be improved > >> > easily. > >> > As a start point simple voting system should be enough, I believe. > >> > I can help with uploads, if needed. > >> > >> Clear criteria and a community vetting process for acceptance are the > >> key points, and in my opinion the way to go about implementing this is > >> to integrate it tightly with Garage: > >> - Make requesting repository access a function of the existing project > >> administrative web-interface, not emailing some dude. > >> - Requesting access through the interface creates an entry in a ticket > >> tracker, where it can be voted and commented on. Access is granted (or > >> not) when a repo admin resolves the ticket. > >> > > Sounds like a plan. Any volunteers? > > > >> >> If there's any additional hoops to jump through people just aren't > >> going > >> >> to bother. > >> > Yeah, I can see that. And you know what? It's not because Nokia not > >> > doing this and that, it's just because of people who don't bother. As > >> a > >> > result we have this mess with tons of repositories and .install files > >> > instead of one extra. And we also have users, who have to deal with > >> this > >> > mess. > >> > >> There will always be people who just don't bother. By creating > >> incentives for participating (larger audience, out-of-box experience) > >> and at the same time lowering the entry bar (automation, well defined > >> process) eventually you would reach critical mass and extras becomes the > >> first choice for a developer seeking a distribution channel. > >> > > I can't say for others but for me personally incentives are obvious: > > - ability to install my favorite packages in one click in AI or one run > > of apt instead of looking for them and dealing with possible > > installation issues. > > - having one place for trusted working software which is known to work > > and tested by others > > - easy upgrades > > - hapiness of users > > > > Isn't it enough? It seems that it isn't and I still don't understand > > why. > > > > > -- Ed Bartosh <eduard.bartosh at nokia.com> Nokia-M/Helsinki
