S Moonesamy <sm+ietf@xxxxxxxxxxxx> wrote: >At 23:15 31-08-2013, Scott Kitterman wrote: >>That does seem better, but don't all parties have an obligation to >attempt to >>communicate clearly? > >The new text is as follows: > >Participants, particularly those with English as a first language, >attempt >to accommodate the needs of other participants by communicating >clearly. > >Participants try to accommodate each other. Except for the part between the commas it's great. As written, it presumes that a mis-communication between a native speaker of English and someone who isn't is the fault of the native speaker. I don't think this is appropriate. Scott K >At 09:08 01-09-2013, Barry Leiba wrote: >>I think Scott has put this perfectly, and it's exactly right. The >>main point is clear communication. Everything else is advice about >>how to achieve that. > >Yes. > >>We're all individuals, and we have different tolerance levels -- some >>of us are more patient than others in trying to understand. That >>said, this is also a collaborative environment, where everyone needs >>to do her part. Native speakers need to use a level of English that's >>likely to be accessible to non-natives, and to do the best they can to >>understand what others are saying. Non-native speakers need to do >>what they can to improve their English skills. Everyone has >>responsibility. > >Yes. > >At 09:22 01-09-2013, Dave Crocker wrote: >>If the document only cites concepts or principles or other terms of >>abstraction, each of us is likely to interpret them /very/ >>differently. Especially for a topic like this. >> >>Worse, even if we interpret them in the same way, we might not >>understand what behaviors to attempt or to avoid, since that often >>requires some understanding of the differences between cultures and >people. > >Yes. > >Brian Trammell explained it better than I could (see >http://www.ietf.org/mail-archive/web/diversity/current/msg00289.html >). Melinda Shore commented about what to avoid (e.g. highly >idiomatic language). > >Somebody in the group, WG Chair, Area Director, or even a >participant, might explain what is causing a communication >problem. At the other end someone who has a problem understanding >what is being said can contact the WG Chair or Area Director >privately so that they can step in and help. > >Regards, >S. Moonesamy