Re: I-D Action:draft-rosenberg-internet-waist-hourglass-00.txt]

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On 14 feb 2008, at 22:24, Jonathan Rosenberg wrote:

>> But it seems to me that a much better approach to this is first of  
>> all  to make it optional, like you suggest, and secondly, make it a  
>> generic  mechanism that can be used for ALL protocols rather that  
>> define it  separately for one protocol at a time.

> Protocol options are bad. Especially ones like this which are quite  
> hard to negotiate. What the draft is saying, is just design the darn  
> thing to work only over UDP, rather than natively over IP. It'll  
> work on the v4 Internet and in the v6 Internet too. Odds are good  
> your protocol needed ports and a checksum anyway. So what exactly is  
> this 'baggage'?

If the protocol needs this stuff anyway, no problem. But for the  
current non-TCP, non-UDP protocols, that doesn't help. Remember the  
computer science adage: put all your eggs in one basket, but make it a  
very good basket. A genereric mechanism to negotiate UDP encapsulation  
for all protocols where desired would find wide deployment and thus  
work well while revisiting every protocol just means having the same  
headache many times over.

The problem that I have with your draft is that you seem to want to  
forbid new non-TCP, non-UDP protocols. If a protocol doesn't need port  
numbers or a UDP-like checksum (i.e., either no checksum or a better  
one) then it's a bad thing to just add a UDP header for the hell of  
it. Especially as overhead keeps growing but MTUs stay the same.

I can envision many cases where UDP encapsulation is useful in IPv4 to  
get around NAT but it's not necessary in IPv6.
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