On 1/25/2021 3:46 PM, Andrew Sullivan wrote:
Hi,
I think I'm the "Andrew" mentioned here, so I'm responding.
Yes you are the Andrew I meant!
ObDisclaimer: I work for the Internet Society, and I'm responding with
that hat on, but this does not represent an Internet Society position
(i.e. I haven't consulted with the Board about this). I'm writing from
my personal address out of convenience.
On Mon, Jan 25, 2021 at 02:06:53PM -0500, Michael StJohns wrote:
make a suggestion: Let's have the last 5 or so Nomcom chairs plus
Andrew drag in the appropriate people from some of the larger
companies and ask them to help us with our candidate diversity
problem. E.g. a substantial portion of the folk that end up as ADs
or IAB or other leadership are funded as part of their employment
with those companies. It might actually be a useful exercise to
look at the input representations we're getting from those companies
and see if perhaps they can work internally to help broaden the
diversity of the set of people they send to the IETF.
Is the idea that we talk to companies that are working in the IETF and
ask them about their employee diversity?
Nope, the idea is "We have a diversity problem, and we're hoping you can
help. Could you take a look at the set of people you send to the IETF
and see if there's anything you can do to increase the diversity of that
set of people over the long term to ideally make it more closely
resemble your internal demographics?"
I confess that I am sceptical about the degree to which such an
approach would be received positively.
Put the way you put it, I would agree. But put the way I put it, they
might find it an interesting challenge and supportive of their own
corporate culture. I'd probably try and engage with the diversity
officer if such a position exists.
For whatever it's worth, I have observed for some time that one path
to broader diversity within the IETF is a culture that is somewhat
less confrontational (not to say occasionally rude and nasty). It
also seems to me that a set of tools that encourage more people to
contribute could help. For people under a certain age, for instance,
mailing lists are primarily a relic of another age. The idea that the
IETF is so special that it needs a completely bespoke set of tools
that interoperate with nothing else is also more than a little hostile
to newcomers. These strike me as things the community could work on
without going to those who subsidize free IETF labour and suggesting
that maybe their employee pool isn't diverse enough.
All organizations have their own culture and their own norms. It's a
fact. As the IETF is some 35+ years old, we have a culture with both a
lot of history and a lot of inertia. It will change slowly, and it
will tend to approach the recent norms of the most active
participants. That's not about bespoke tools - it's just the way
things are.
And - please avoid the somewhat insulting inferences of what I meant -
you could have avoided them in both places in this response by simply
asking for clarification.
the ADs especially have to make. In academic terms - an endowed
chair.
I think it is up to the community as to whether it wants to pay its ADs
That's not what I said and I think you know that. What I noted was
there were a number of very capable people in the IETF who lack the
support to take on a role that's not directly related to putting food on
their tables. Providing one additional possible resource for those folk
to get an offer of support is not "paying its AD's".
In this last go around, I became aware that a well-qualified candidate
had decided not to stand due to a lack of sufficient financial support.
I put out some feelers and was able to find a possible source of support
and connected them with the candidate. I'm aware of a number of sole
consultants that over the years have been able to find sources of
support for the work of the IETF (in the general vs the normal "please
help us standardize 'foo'") and all I'm suggesting is to possibly help
with that process.
; I suspect such a move would be controversial, but I will express no
opinion as to whether it's a good idea. I think, however, that the
IETF would possibly have the resources to undertake that if it is
successful in its fundraising: the Internet Society has agreed to
match funds up to a ceiling (see the announcement from last year), so
the IETF would appear to have this option without the Internet Society
undertaking such fundraising on behalf of the IETF. I believe also
that, in light of the control of the IETF endowment, it would be at
least confusing if the Internet Society undertook such fundraising now.
I suggested your participation as the person who selects the Nomcom
chair, not for any desire to have the ISOC be funding AD and IAB positions.
Later, Mike
Best regards,
A
