On Sun, Jun 20, 2021 11:41:41 -0700, Kevin Fenzi wrote: > On Sun, Jun 20, 2021 at 03:26:52PM +0000, Zbigniew Jędrzejewski-Szmek wrote: > > > > Yeah. I'm looking a the original ticket in > > https://pagure.io/fesco/issue/2228, and I think this was a mistake. > > We shouldn't have approved a bot that packages snapshot commits for > > rawhide. In the discussion, we talked about load on the infra, and ability > > to contact the maintainers, and even cooperation withb packit, but somehow > > the question whether we want this at all didn't come up. > > > > I guess the effort to make rawhide palatable hadn't really sunk in > > deep enough back then ;) > > Well, it's still not clear to me if these builds are not suitable for > rawhide, or if the bot that is pushing them just has bugs. A few podman updates have now caused major breakages for users even in stable releases. Here's a recent example: https://bodhi.fedoraproject.org/updates/FEDORA-2021-fc15685f73 https://bugzilla.redhat.com/show_bug.cgi?id=1958546 https://github.com/containers/podman/issues/10274 ^ In this an RC went out all the way to the updates repo, but it seems like pushing RCs to testing is very common for podman: https://bodhi.fedoraproject.org/updates/?search=&packages=podman&releases=F34&releases=F33&page=2 (This is not OK in my book either---volunteers using updates-testing to help test updates should not have to deal with updates that are not intended for distribution to users, but yet somehow do make it through from time to time.) It has now happened a couple of times (in my experience) that an update went out, *very* quickly reached stable (sometimes before it was even pushed to testing), and so reached users---where it was found that the update broke core functionality. Because it was already marked stable, by the time folks tested it out and gave negative karma, it could no longer be un-pushed. I don't think there's a policy against this, but apart from podman, I cannot recall seeing maintainers/dev teams give karma to their own packages' updates. I don't think that works---the idea of Bodhi is to allow ample opportunity for *others* to test the update, no? If maintainers smoke test, push updates, and then again give karma based on the smoke test, they're hardly likely to catch issues? Here's one where an essentially broken update got 3 positive karma from folks involved in podman development: https://bodhi.fedoraproject.org/updates/FEDORA-2020-cd7e382e0c Here's another where folks related to podman development said "works" (but gave negative karma to prevent it from going to stable) and then, it turned out that the update was actually broken: https://bodhi.fedoraproject.org/updates/FEDORA-2020-ad5899f2c3 I think bots are great but only as long as they continue to implement the packaging policies that we've all agreed on. The bot isn't doing that very well here. -- Thanks, Regards, Ankur Sinha "FranciscoD" (He / Him / His) | https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/User:Ankursinha Time zone: Europe/London
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