Le 2018-12-12 18:49, Kevin Fenzi a écrit :
On 12/12/18 4:10 AM, Ben Rosser wrote:
On Tue, Dec 11, 2018 at 4:07 PM Till Maas <opensource@xxxxxxxxx>
wrote:
Hi Ben,
On Tue, Dec 11, 2018 at 11:42:51AM +0100, Ben Rosser wrote:
I don't know. I feel like we could do a lot to improve the
experience
of packaging by investing time into fixing these sorts of minor
annoyances. (But here I am complaining on the devel list and not
actually doing anything to help, so I guess I'm part of the problem
too).
you are right. I am thinking this, too. Would you maybe be interested
in
making this a Community Objective[0] such as "Packaging Contribution
Experience"?
Kind regards
Till
[0] https://docs.fedoraproject.org/en-US/project/objectives/
Hi Till,
Sure, I think it would be great to have packager quality of life as a
community objective! Should I start by writing something up and
sending an email to council-discuss?
I'm not sure this really deserves the level of community objective...
but perhaps I am wrong.
Not treating it as a community objective is how we got in a situation,
where upstreams (including @rh upstreams) want nothing to do with rpms
and Fedora, and invent their own packaging tech to bypass Linux
distributions completely. They're not doing it for lofty theoretical
reasons. Those are added later as PC justifications. The root cause of
why they behave like this, is that they feel, the packager experience
Fedora (or Debian, or Ubuntu) sucks loads. It used not to suck, when it
matched perfectly c/c++ autotools needs, and then it slowly degraded as
things were not updated to match new needs and packagers were asked to
fill in the gaps.
IMHO, it mostly needs people spending time and driving it. First,
gathering a list of issues that are non ideal for maintainers,
That's quite easy to do and you'll find no end of volunteers to document
their packaging roadblocks. And they're not limited to the pagure
behavior…
then
finding out what it would take to solve each and helping create and
land
fixes for them, be that a pagure bugfix or a workflow change or
whatever.
… but only if there is an effort at the Fedora level to act on this
list. That's means infra time, and that means Fedora leadership time to
make sure infra has this time and actually uses it to fix the issues
packagers reported.
Been there, done that, not interested in filling new issues no one wants
to work on or look at. Already doing too much of that lately.
Regards,
--
Nicolas Mailhot
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