On Tue, 2002-10-08 at 17:05, Havoc Pennington wrote: > It's nonsense to say the WM should not bind any keys by default (and > also nonsense that users should have to change default keybindings to > use an application). The only reasonable way out of the problem is to > coordinate between the apps and the WM who will own which keys. Ummm, I would disagree here. You may disagree with his comment, but it's certainly not nonsense. We work on a commercial animation package called Houdini, which *requires* access to Alt-mouseclick key equivs. Houdini runs on Irix, Linux, Solaris and Windows, and it's only Gnome and KDE that requires the user to turn off features of the desktop before you can use the app. The same problem occurs with Maya - another animation package that runs on most of the above platforms. I'm all for customization(another issue I won't touch on since I know you're racing to implement missing features here), but expecting the people writing the app to coordinate with you everytime they use a key equiv? When they're porting to several platforms? I'm not sure it will happen. Would you grab and use Ctl-v? Ctl-c? Of course not, because they're typically used by apps. I think this is a case of you being exposed to a certain set of apps and not others. There's nothing wrong with that - but I take issue with the decision to hardwire event grabs into the wm without any way of turning it off. I would have preferred to have a simpler wm that has less "features" that are added slowly, with access. Damage is already done, but I guess just for the future, I'm pointing this out for what it's worth. I intend this in the most positive fashion, not as a flame. I would have been *far* less upset about wasting 5 days digging through the inet for answers if RH, or Gnome, or *someone* gave an easy out to metacity with clear documentation somewhere. This is always my biggest complaint each time a new release of something Linux comes out. A handful of gurus know the answers, and they must be nagged by frustrated end users until the net is finally, a year later, flooded with disorganized answers. I understand you've got a patch in there now re: some equivs, but we're also suffering from a lockout with houdini related only to metacity(sawfish/KDE run fine). I'm not sure how bugzilla could deal with that given it's a commercial product - I'll guess I'll leave it with the app company to deal with it if they wish...or they'll probably just say "turn off metacity".... Cheers, J.C. -- John Coldrick www.axyzfx.com Axyz Animation Houdini/Renderman/Discreet 425 Adelaide St W 416-504-0425 Toronto, ON Canada jc@axyzfx.com M5V 1S4 ----------------------------------------------------------------------- Men of lofty genius when they are doing the least work are most active. -- Leonardo da Vinci
