Re: IAOC, travel and hotel prices (was RE: Hyatt Taipei cancellation policy?)

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At 06:31 24-08-2011, George, Wesley wrote:
Perhaps it?s time for those who seem most concerned about this to author a BCP draft regarding IETF meeting venue and hotel selection policies that addresses this, so that

See draft-palet-ietf-meeting-venue-selection-criteria-04 (expired).

IAOC has a bit clearer instructions and a documented policy based on community consensus, rather than this discussion continuing to come up every couple of meetings, and the general response from the IAOC being ?this is hard, we?re doing the best we can? [example, explanation]?

It's safer to stick to a tried strategy.

Not to say that I doubt the intentions or efforts of any of the IAOC folks past or present, but the theme I keep seeing in these discussions is a request for both transparency and price sensitivity, and I?m not sure that the feedback is being acknowledged so much as it is being treated as a request for explanation of the extenuating circumstances.

My guess is that the contact covers:

 (a) Guest substitution

 (b) Client attrition

 (c) Guaranteed reservations and the terms for a refund

 (d) Reservation cut-off

 (e) Hotel rate after cut-off

Some of the information could probably be made available at the time of the announcement of the venue selection. Although it still won't be possible to select a different venue, it gives the community ample time to complain.

Glen Zorn mentioned that "the end result being that major corporate support would be mandatory for attendants: independents, academics and even employees of small companies need not apply". Lixia Zhang mentioned that "up to now IETF hotel prices have been within the federal per diem allowance". Peter Saint-Andre mentioned that "thanks to tips from other cost-conscious IETFers, [he] was able to find hotels costing $100". Ray mentioned that "Many places they just don't need our business".

A rough number for hotel and travel costs might be as follows:

  U.S. to Taiwan:     $3,619
  U.K. to Taiwan:     $3,765
  China to Taiwan:    $3,094

  U.S. to Paris:      $3,841
  U.K. to Paris:      $2,325
  China to Paris:     $3,780

  U.S. to Vancouver:  $3,226
  U.K. to Vancouver:  $5,535
  China to Vancouver: $4,212

The question of cross-subsidization has not been brought into the discussion yet. There is also the question of rotation across continents. Over the years U.S. IETF participation (used loosely) has dropped to 50%. IETF participation from the European Union has increased to 25%. IETF participation from Asia has increased to 15%. The choice of IETF meeting venue has an impact on U.S. participation. Based on the above numbers, I would have concluded that it shouldn't. I doubt that U.S. participants encounter visa issues. Maybe it is because those without major corporate support find the attendance too expensive.

Is there any hypothesis about why this type of discussion does not occur when a venue in the U.S. is selected?

Regards,
-sm
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