On Aug 23, 2011, at 1:34 AM, John C Klensin wrote: > > > --On Monday, August 22, 2011 20:16 -0400 Ray Pelletier > <rpelletier@xxxxxxxx> wrote: > >> ... >> As for the rates, they are high. Taiwan is expensive, >> particularly given that the hotels know what our options are >> when we book the TICC. The Hyatt knew that foreign visitors >> needed to use the Hyatt as headquarters and charged >> accordingly. Since the time of our site visit, 2 new hotels >> have been constructed in the vicinity of the TICC (Le Meridien >> and W), which may provide more competition for Hyatt in these >> circumstances. At the time we were working on this event, >> there were no acceptable options. > > Ray, > > I know you want to find sponsors and go where the sponsors want > to go. I accept the explanation that you negotiated as hard as > you could for both room rates and cancellation policies. But I > have to wonder, especially in the light of Lixia's observation > about the US Govt rate (which, internationally, is often a > pretty good measure for the higher end of a reasonable rate in a > given city), whether there is a stopping rule. We were told in > Quebec that you had given up on one Southeast Asian city because > rooms would have cost over USD 300 a night. I don't remember > hearing about a sponsor there. What looks like USD 275 net is > not all that much less than USD 300, especially if the dollar > continues to sink. > > So, if you had a sponsor for a future meeting at that other > location, would an estimated USD 300 be acceptable? USD 350? > > I obviously don't have all of the information available to me > that you and the IAOC do, but it seems to be there is always > another alternative. If there are no local ones, that > alternative is usually described as "just say no and go > elsewhere". What I'm trying to understand, mostly for the > future and with the understanding that it is presumably much too > late for Taipei and the several following meetings, is whether > you would ever consider that an option for a meeting for which > you have a sponsor if you hold it in a particular place or if > you and the IAOC really believe there is no alternative under > those circumstances. The IAOC has adopted a program of booking venues 3 years in advance. This will open up more venue choices as we found that even 2 years out we were shut out of places. The other effect is that these venue decisions will be made for the most part without sponsors and sponsors driving meeting locations. Typically sponsors become engaged 18 or fewer months before a meeting, probably for budgetary reasons. Many places they just don't need our business, and don't budge from their $300+USD guest room rates, or their $350k + cost for meeting space. We turn elsewhere. The meeting in Paris was going to be in another major European city for which we were actively engaged in a discussion with a Host. However, the venue was outside the city center, so the plug was pulled and moved to Paris - where we still do not have a Host. Sponsors welcome! The points are that the IAOC is not going to select a poor venue because it may have a sponsor; nor a $300+ USD guest room rate for the headquarters hotel. Ray > > john > > > john > > > _______________________________________________ > Ietf mailing list > Ietf@xxxxxxxx > https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/ietf _______________________________________________ Ietf mailing list Ietf@xxxxxxxx https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/ietf