Re: On being public (Was: Call for Nominees)

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On Sep 15, 2008, at 12:05 PM, Leslie Daigle wrote:

>
> A few things to consider:
>
> Yes, the NOMCOM WG that developed RFC3777 did explicitly discuss issue
> of openness of candidacy, and determine that it was best left as  
> part of
> the confidential information.  There were plenty of pros & cons.  The
> pros of openness as you cite below; the cons included potential for
> campaigning (if not the candidate themselves, people who supported
> them), as well as difficulty in getting people to step forward. We  
> need
> to have some cultural sophistication if we're going to ask Sue to run
> against incumbent Bob openly, given that Sue's WG has documents  
> waiting
> for Bob's approval.

Dear Leslie;

Given the large number of cultures of the IETF participants, I think  
that
asking for cultural sophistication is asking for a lot.

Regards
Marshall

>
> Secondly, it's not really useful (to the whole system) if only some
> candidates declare themselves publicly.   If some people agree with  
> your
> exhortation below, other candidates for the same positions will be  
> more
> or less obliged to come out in order to ensure that the NomCom gets
> adequate input on them, too.
>
> My point:  it's not a simple decision, and it really is something the
> IETF community as a whole should come to grips with and have a
> consistent policy for.
>
> (Currently, that policy is in RFC3777).
>
> Leslie.
>
>
> Pete Resnick wrote:
>> On 9/12/08 at 9:46 AM -0700, NomCom Chair wrote:
>>
>>> If you are willing to serve, please nominate yourself.
>>> If there is someone you think would do a good job, please nominate  
>>> them.
>>
>> I'd like to take this opportunity to encourage people to do something
>> more open and transparent than we have in the past, without any
>> changes to rules or NomCom activity.
>>
>> As we all know, the NomCom process is confidential. That is, whatever
>> one says to the NomCom with regard to nominees cannot be revealed by
>> the NomCom. That's a good idea: People need to be frank and honest
>> without worrying about jeopardizing personal relationships. However,
>> the confidentiality requirement has always also been read to mean
>> that the list of nominees must also be kept confidential. That's not
>> entirely clear in RFC 3777, but that's always been the practice. (I
>> believe the intent was to dissuade any kind of "campaigning", to
>> avoid discomfort about "running against" an incumbent or popular
>> nominee, as well as avoiding embarrassment for nominees who are not
>> chosen.) But this has a terrible side effect: The NomCom is unable to
>> get full feedback on nominees, both in the positive and the negative.
>> If you are unaware that Joe is up for the Foobar Area Director, you
>> may not have the opportunity to say to the NomCom, "Wow! It never
>> even occurred to me to think of Joe as a potential Foobar AD. He'd be
>> perfect!" Or conversely, "It never occurred to me that anyone
>> (including Joe himself) would seriously consider him for Foobar AD.
>> He'd be a disaster!"
>>
>> There are just so many resources the NomCom has at its disposal to
>> get good information about nominees. We want folks who could provide
>> feedback to take the initiative, but they're really only going to do
>> so if they know who has their hat in the ring.
>>
>> Though I think campaigning should be avoided, I think the other
>> issues surrounding revealing the names of nominees are not all that
>> problematic:
>>
>> - We should all get over the notion that any particular nominee "must
>> obviously be chosen". It may turn out (perhaps on the *day* that the
>> NomCom is making their decision) that our favorite cannot serve
>> because they lose all funding in their current position, or change
>> jobs and no longer have the ability to serve, or die unexpectedly.
>> (And these things have happened.) We should be able to comment on all
>> of the candidates on the off chance that they are the NomCom's
>> apparent best choice.
>>
>> - The fact that the NomCom must keep the reasons for *not* choosing
>> any particular candidate confidential mitigates the embarrassment of
>> not being chosen.
>>
>> Obviously we can't change 3777 for this NomCom. However, there is
>> nothing in 3777 or elsewhere that *requires* any nominee to keep
>> their own nomination confidential. So, I'd like to encourage nominees
>> to be public. Here's what I have in mind: If you've been nominated,
>> post a simple message to the IETF list of the following form:
>>
>> "My name was submitted to the NomCom for the position of <Foobar AD>,
>> and I've told the NomCom I'm willing to be considered. Of course,
>> this is no guarantee that if I get selected, I'd still be able to
>> serve. Please send them whatever positive or negative feedback you
>> have."
>>
>> End of message. No commentary on why you'd be wonderful (or terrible)
>> for the job. Just inviting people to comment.
>>
>> Thoughts on this?
>>
>> pr
>
> -- 
>
> -------------------------------------------------------------------
> "Reality:
>      Yours to discover."
>                                 -- ThinkingCat
> Leslie Daigle
> leslie@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
> -------------------------------------------------------------------
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