On Sun, 2021-10-17 at 15:56 -0400, Nico Kadel-Garcia wrote: > On Sun, Oct 17, 2021 at 3:36 PM Chris Murphy <lists@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx> > wrote: > > > > > > > > On Sat, Oct 16, 2021, 10:01 PM Kevin Kofler via devel > > <devel@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > I still remember how Red Hat Linux and (IIRC) Fedora Core 1 could > > > be booted > > > from a floppy (older Red Hat Linux releases even had a fully > > > functioning > > > rescue mode on the floppy, later ones could at least still boot a > > > HDD > > > install from the boot floppy, which is how I installed them, and in > > > that way > > > also boot the rescue mode). These days, the minimum boot image > > > (know known > > > as the netinst ISO) barely fits on a CD, and in Fedora 33 even > > > exceeded CD > > > size (https://pagure.io/minimization/issue/23). The Fedora 34 > > > netinst image > > > is still 450 times the size of a floppy! > > > > > > > > The top two reasons for this: a significant portion of anaconda used > > to be downloaded, and now is included on the media; linux-firmware > > bloat, which is the fastest growing package for the past few years. > > Front this point there's a bunch of pressure points and trade-offs. > > This cycle we were over CD-ROM size of 700MiB, and ended up trimming > > out about 30M from linux-firmware. > > > > -- > > Chris Murphy > > It's also X based with GUI's, rather than an ncurses based graphical > interface. Reviewing a fresh install, there is little to nothing that > couldn't be done in a much, much smaller text interface going through > a linear checklist with ncurses, and follow Eric Raymond's old > guidelines for open source interfaces titled "The Luxury of > Ignorance". But some folks like pretty GUIs, even though sophisticated > GUI's cost resources to run. For the record, Anaconda has a text interface that supports configuring a sizeable subset of what the GUI can configure. It looks like this: https://m4rtink.fedorapeople.org/screenshots/fedora/rawhide_f36/f36_anaconda_tui_01.png https://m4rtink.fedorapeople.org/screenshots/fedora/rawhide_f36/f36_anaconda_tui_02.png Just append "inst.text" to the installation image boot options to try it out. :) As for RAM requirements at installation time - it's complicated. :P As already mentioned, the installation image has grown and in some scenarios its size can directly impact RAM requirements, as the image needs to be downloaded and held in RAM at installation size (PXE boot with HTTP installation source). In other cases there is no direct impact on RAM via image size - if you boot from say a flash drive or PXE boot with innstallation sorce on NFS, most of the installation image will be streamed to to RAM only as needed. BTW, there is just a single installation image, that contains all the dependencies needed to run both the graphical and text interfaces. It would be technically possible create quite a bit smaller TUI/kickstart only image without all the GUI deps but AFAIK so far no one was interested in doing that given the additional QA and releng resources needed for yet another Fedora deliverable. UI also affects resource usage, which is one of the reasons Anaconda has not only the graphical but also the text UI. (The other reason being systems that simply can't boot to GUI for various reasons.) Additionally Anaconda also sets up zram at installation time, to reduce ram requirements even further via compression. So in short the best current scenario is Anaconda booted in text mode from a USB stick or via PXE with NFS installation source - that should require the least amount of RAM at installation time. Still even then, especially with kickstart installations that have elaborate post scripts (that need RAM to run as well!) or install tons of packages (depsolving as well as elaborate RPM scriptlets need RAM!) can still throw a wrench into the works. And lastly, LUKS2 uses the Argon2 key derivation function that by design requires quite a bit of memory, to make password brute forcing less viable (eq. to parallel password guessing the attacker needs quite a bit of memory per parallel guess run). This can also influence minimum RAM requirements quite a bit. Best Wishes Martin Kolman > _______________________________________________ > devel mailing list -- devel@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx > To unsubscribe send an email to devel-leave@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx > Fedora Code of Conduct: > https://docs.fedoraproject.org/en-US/project/code-of-conduct/ > List Guidelines: https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Mailing_list_guidelines > List Archives: > https://lists.fedoraproject.org/archives/list/devel@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx > Do not reply to spam on the list, report it: > https://pagure.io/fedora-infrastructure _______________________________________________ devel mailing list -- devel@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx To unsubscribe send an email to devel-leave@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx Fedora Code of Conduct: https://docs.fedoraproject.org/en-US/project/code-of-conduct/ List Guidelines: https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Mailing_list_guidelines List Archives: https://lists.fedoraproject.org/archives/list/devel@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx Do not reply to spam on the list, report it: https://pagure.io/fedora-infrastructure
