Ben Cotton wrote: > ...changes in default behavior, when 1. technically reasonable and 2. > not explicitly overridden by the user, should generally be made on > upgrade. I disagree. Upgrades should be as unsurprising as possible and keep user configuration as much as possible. Changes in defaults should normally (i.e., where technically reasonable) only be done for new installs. For upgrades, any changes should normally be opt-in, not opt-out. > Distributions are supposed to be opinionated No, absolutely not. Distributions are supposed to be at the users' service, not the other way round. > and in cases where the user has accepted our opinion, we should do our > best to provide it whether the system in question is an upgrade or a fresh > install. But as you state it: > The difficulty here is cases where the user also has an opinion that > formerly aligned with the distribution's opinion and no longer does. Just because the user agreed with your former opinion does not mean they will agree with you making a U-turn on it as well. And please note that this is NOT about my personal editor preference: I personally think nano is the much more user-friendly editor and my vi knowledge is limited to ":q!". So I think the new default definitely makes sense, for new installations, and I'll happily take the opt-in when I upgrade my systems. (I rarely use the default editor because I mostly use GUIs, so I usually just temporarily override EDITOR to something sane, usually kwrite because I'm in a GUI environment, and have never bothered actually setting EDITOR systemwide.) I just do not agree that the default editor should be forcefully changed for all existing installations. Also because, each time I upgrade Fedora, I routinely have to go through the list of Changes and undo whatever can be undone. > In most cases, the benefits to a consistent experience outweigh the > detriments of the user having to explicitly override an opinion. I think not making surprising changes to existing installations is more important than consistency between old/upgraded and new installations. > (I include the phrase "technically reasonable" above to account for > cases like changing the default file system, which is not something > you'd particularly want to try changing on existing systems at upgrade > time) Of course, my opposite opinion should be understood with the same limitation: Sometimes it is just not technically reasonable to keep supporting the old default, e.g., if it depends on some software package that is no longer maintained upstream. (E.g., I am NOT proposing that the KDE Spin should keep defaulting to Plasma 5 for upgrades after Plasma 6 is out, that would make no sense.) But where it is technically reasonable, changes should always be opt-in, not opt-out, for upgrades. Kevin Kofler _______________________________________________ devel mailing list -- devel@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx To unsubscribe send an email to devel-leave@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx Fedora Code of Conduct: https://docs.fedoraproject.org/en-US/project/code-of-conduct/ List Guidelines: https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Mailing_list_guidelines List Archives: https://lists.fedoraproject.org/archives/list/devel@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx