It's reasonable for people who draw our attention to a pervasive problem to expect us to listen. I for one appreciate you being willing to go with guidelines it changes, it's helpful. One note on IT though: plenty of studies show that it's absolutely *not* a diverse labor force. And I don't mean they argue whether it is it isn't. It's simple fact, it's not. So we can't rely on "lots of people contribute" when so few people contributing tend to be people of color. It's important to remember this isn't about intent. No one's being judged here. This is about setting up for better inclusivity in the future, nothing more or less. On Tue, Jun 23, 2020, 7:56 PM SysOp <sysop+fedora@xxxxxxxxxxxx> wrote: > I'll agree with the previous two comments. I tend to try and be inclusive > to everyone (with a few exceptions) but overreacting here won't fix > anything. I'll do my best to follow whatever guidelines/changes are needed > but I'd rather everyone just be reasonable adults in the first place, and > not much in IT has anything to do with race etc as the internet tends to be > international with people of all races contributing quite a bit. > > > On that note if anyone feels I've excluded them (in the past or future) > it probably wasn't intentional ping me and we can hopefully sort it out. > > On June 23, 2020 6:23:03 PM CDT, s40w5s@xxxxxxxxx wrote: > >I tend to lean in your direction on this Richard, but I don't really > >feel strongly about it enough to object to rephrasing things to suit > >some. In the larger context, doing nothing and sticking with what we > >currently have is also a viable option as this does feel a bit "knee > >jerk" in it's context. (ie... response to a single comment, and > >additional corporate influence to look correct in light of today's > >environment). Personally, I think if we took Greg's suggestion about > >having a grammar and dictionary plugin on the WP site prompt us about > >sensitive words that would go a long way. But more importantly if we as > >a group wish to have some positive influence on the discussion, we > >should be promoting more diversity and equality throughout the magazine > >and indeed the Fedora organization wherever we can. > >Also, to add to what you are saying, forcing someone to a POV doesn't > >succeed in winning them over. It's only through communication and idea > >sharing that we can break down these barriers, and learn from each > >other. Education, Equity, Empathy are the beginning steps. The Fedora > >Foundations are a good starting point to work from. > > > >Stephen > > > >On Tue, 2020-06-23 at 17:05 -0500, Richard Shaw wrote: > >> Ok, so as the writer of the article here are my thoughts... > >> > >> I'm OK with changing the term if it add clarity, but I'm against > >> changing > >> it just because it contains the name "black". > >> > >> It's a color. There are black pens, marks, crayons, etc (as far as > >> reference to the color). > >> > >> Blacklisting something (or someone) has a long history of use (at > >> least in > >> English) which has nothing to do with race. > >> > >> I don't see changing this particular article as a problem, but rather > >> as a > >> stepping stone to a run-away issue for which there is no solution and > >> I'm > >> not in favor of "cleansing" language to appease people who can't help > >> themselves from being offended even when there's no reason to be. > >> > >> Thanks, > >> Richard > >> _______________________________________________ > >> Fedora Magazine mailing list -- magazine@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx > >> To unsubscribe send an email to > >> magazine-leave@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx > >> Fedora Code of Conduct: > >> https://docs.fedoraproject.org/en-US/project/code-of-conduct/ > >> List Guidelines: > >> https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Mailing_list_guidelines > >> List Archives: > >> > https://lists.fedoraproject.org/archives/list/magazine@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx > >_______________________________________________ > >Fedora Magazine mailing list -- magazine@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx > >To unsubscribe send an email to magazine-leave@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx > >Fedora Code of Conduct: > https://docs.fedoraproject.org/en-US/project/code-of-conduct/ > >List Guidelines: https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Mailing_list_guidelines > >List Archives: > https://lists.fedoraproject.org/archives/list/magazine@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx > _______________________________________________ > Fedora Magazine mailing list -- magazine@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx > To unsubscribe send an email to magazine-leave@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx > Fedora Code of Conduct: > https://docs.fedoraproject.org/en-US/project/code-of-conduct/ > List Guidelines: https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Mailing_list_guidelines > List Archives: > https://lists.fedoraproject.org/archives/list/magazine@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx > _______________________________________________ Fedora Magazine mailing list -- magazine@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx To unsubscribe send an email to magazine-leave@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx Fedora Code of Conduct: https://docs.fedoraproject.org/en-US/project/code-of-conduct/ List Guidelines: https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Mailing_list_guidelines List Archives: https://lists.fedoraproject.org/archives/list/magazine@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
