Le lundi 01 juin 2020 à 10:45 +0200, Adam Samalik a écrit : > So I've read all the comments and I feel there are a few people for > the > move and no one clearly against. But we have some concerns or > undecided, too. > > Some of the pros are that a forum is more accessible and feels more > inclusive and open to newcomers. There were also comments about > mailing > lists being seen as confusing or even archaic. Personally, my concern with discourse is that while that's much better for new comers (there is a tutorial, there is richer text edit which permit more way to express one self, etc), anything requiring to go on a web page is likely less efficient than a rich email client, due to network latency among others, but also because I can run 1 client and access several projects discussion at once, while I would need to check several discourses with the risk of forgetting one otherwise. However, I know there is a way to be notified by mail (the so called "mailing list mode" in "preferences"/"email"), and while I didn't tried it (yet), I do assume that the worst that would happen with it wouldn't be different than a discussion on a bugzilla/pagure/github ticket. So it would solve part of the problem of being able to watch over several discussions in a efficient way (still no way to efficiently answer, but I never participate here, just watch for things around hosting, so we wouldn't lose much by a move). Now, as a side note, before moving anything, I would also go see whoever pay for the instance and verify that there is enough capacity on the service (based on current traffic estimation), and if not, see if we have budget for it. I do not know how much we pay now and/or the traffic, but if we pay 100 US$ per month, the next step is 300 US$ per month (so a 2400 US$ increase in the budget). And if we are already at the 300 US$ step, the next one is "call us": https://www.discourse.org/pricing However, looking at https://budget.fedoraproject.org/budget/fy19/council.html , it seems we are already in the upper tier. > Some of you just like the idea of consolidation of our channels and > are for > the change for this reason. > > Also, we had some confusion about new creating accounts or proposing > other > self-hosting alternatives. I'm only proposing Discourse because > Fedora > already has one, and it works with the Fedora account system: > https://discussion.fedoraproject.org/ So there are no new accounts > involved, and we won't be deploying yet another service, just using > what's > already available. > > And then there was one concern about this proposal not solving the > problem > with having Pagure separated. And while I kind of agree it's not > solving > the disconnect directly, I believe that moving all the discussions > into one > place helps people see the proposals and engage with them more. And > yes, > we'll still need to make a card for each article, but it will be > easier to > just see it and do it. Or we can ask the person proposing the idea to > create the card and link back to the discussion. I think that just > the fact > of it being more visible helps. And the reason I propose moving to > Discourse (rather than using the mailing list for this) is the > accessibility and the ability to easily link to the discussion. > > I realize it's not a perfect solution, but I think it's the best > reasonable > option we have. We're basically choosing between the following three > solutions: > > 1/ Keep what we have now. Proposals in Pagure, general discussion on > the > list, tracking in Taiga. > 2/ Proposals AND general discussion in Discourse, tracking in Taiga. > 3/ The same as 2, but using a mailing list. So proposals and > discussion on > the list, and tracking in Taiga. > > Options 2 and 3 have all the discussions in one place — being it > proposals > or anything else. But what I propose, option 2, is to have a place > that's > more accessible, more open to newcomers or casual contributors, and > easy to > link to. > > And even if we somehow automated the process of creating Taiga cards > from > Pagure, or moved the proposals directly to Taiga, we'd still had > discussion > on two different places, keeping the engagement on the proposals > quite low > as we have it now. > > > So, to move forward, are there people strongly against? Especially > those of > you who are concerned. Or are we willing to give this a shot? > > On Mon, Jun 1, 2020 at 9:25 AM Clement Verna < > cverna@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx> > wrote: > > > > > > > On Wed, 27 May 2020 at 16:15, Adam Samalik <asamalik@xxxxxxxxxx> > > wrote: > > > > > What if we moved to Discourse [1]? > > > > > > We touched this during today's meeting [2] towards the end. > > > > > > Right now we have various things in three different places: > > > 1/ This mailing list for general discussion > > > 2/ Pagure repository [3] for article proposals and discussion > > > around those > > > 3/ Taiga board [4] to track the editorial workflow > > > > > > Discourse would replace this mailing list and the Pagure > > > repository, so > > > we'd have one place to discuss anything. And unlike a mailing > > > list, we > > > could link to individual threads easily, new members could join > > > us and see > > > all the previous discussions, etc. > > > > > > I especially like this for article proposals. More people would > > > be able to > > > see them and comment on them, and after a proposal gets approved > > > we could > > > easily link the thread from the Taiga card. > > > > > > Back in 2017-1018, the Forman community did a similar move [5] > > > [6] and > > > their engagement doubled. But it's a different community and a > > > few years > > > back, so it doesn't promise anything to us. But I still find it > > > interesting. > > > > > > What do people think? > > > > > > > I am generally +1 to move to discourse but I also don't participate > > that > > much in this mailing list :-) > > > > > > > > > > Cheers, > > > Adam > > > > > > [1] https://discussion.fedoraproject.org/ > > > [2] > > > > > > https://meetbot.fedoraproject.org/fedora-meeting/2020-05-27/magazine.2020-05-27-12.01.log.html > > > [3] https://pagure.io/fedora-magazine-proposals/issues > > > [4] > > > https://teams.fedoraproject.org/project/asamalik-fedora-magazine/kanban > > > [5] > > > https://theforeman.org/2017/12/foreman-migrates-to-discourse.html > > > [6] > > > https://theforeman.org/2018/07/discourse-6-months-on-impact-assesment.html > > > > > > -- > > > > > > Adam Šamalík > > > --------------------------- > > > Senior Software Engineer > > > Red Hat > > > _______________________________________________ > > > Fedora Magazine mailing list -- magazine@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx > > > To unsubscribe send an email to > > > magazine-leave@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx > > > Fedora Code of Conduct: > > > https://docs.fedoraproject.org/en-US/project/code-of-conduct/ > > > List Guidelines: > > > https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Mailing_list_guidelines > > > List Archives: > > > https://lists.fedoraproject.org/archives/list/magazine@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx > > > > > -- > > Adam Šamalík > --------------------------- > Senior Software Engineer > Red Hat > _______________________________________________ > Fedora Magazine mailing list -- magazine@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx > To unsubscribe send an email to > magazine-leave@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx > Fedora Code of Conduct: > https://docs.fedoraproject.org/en-US/project/code-of-conduct/ > List Guidelines: > https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Mailing_list_guidelines > List Archives: > https://lists.fedoraproject.org/archives/list/magazine@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx -- Michael Scherer / He/Il/Er/Él Sysadmin, Community Infrastructure
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