On Wednesday 31 January 2007 02:16:28 Eero Tamminen wrote: > Hi, > > (this is not an official comment on anything, just my personal opinions) > > ext Gavin O' Gorman wrote: > > On 1/30/07, Karl Bellve <Karl.Bellve at umassmed.edu> wrote: > >> Personally, I wish Nokia would have went with thunderbird and firefox > >> that could be improved by the outside community. Instead, they went with > >> buggy pieces of proprietary code that Nokia can't seem to fix on its > >> own. > >> > >> My other big complaint is that the entire device has to be reflashed in > >> order to run the new version of the OS. Why can't they update different > >> pieces, like the browser, or the kernel? Since the browser and flash > >> player hasn't been updated, I don't think I will update my Nokia 770. > > I think some of the reasons are: > - Licence restrictions > - Hardware changes between the devices and dependencies on these > - API changes between the different releases (sometimes just reflecting > the different hardware, sometimes for other reasons). You can read > more on this from here: > http://maemo.org/maemowiki/Os2007On770 > - Supporting mixing and matching of different package versions > would explode the (already very large) required testing effort. Why I'm curious do you think this would be any worse than dealing with Debian in the desktop world? debs are very capable of handling this kind of conflict, for example you couldn't using apt install an amd64 compiled deb onto a x86 compiled OS. > - If you really want to upgrade (a small subset of the components) to > the very latest versions, you can do that using the development etc > repositories (sardine/herring/bora etc). However, this is not > supported for obvious reasons and you *will* need to reflash your > device occasionally *when* (not if) things break In my case there are things I'd remove rather than mix and match. In short freeing up room for things I do want. > > These things will improve with time as both Open Source components > and Maemo platform mature and the gap between them can diminish. > > > I agree wholeheartedly with these points ! I would extend them further > > to ask why the 770 OS cannot be as open as a standard debian > > distribution. > > (assuming you still refer to package updates) > > Debian is not a "consumer" distribution, it's a "developer" > / "Linux user" distribution. > > Debian way would mean users doing largest part of testing, finding and > reporting the bugs instead of Nokia, right? You know, these devices > are not viable if they remain hacker devices, they're supposed to be > consumer device and consumers are not interested in testing things, > they want things to work when they buy a device. More on package > updates as a general strategy below... > > > That is, comprised of a standard kernel that gets the device up and > > running, with proprietary drivers available as binary .debs. All the > > various applications distributed and installable as seperate .debs. > > This way unwanted applications can be removed, for example, the > > ridiculous email client etc. Kernels should be upgradable with a > > simple apt-get, the package management mess should be cleaned up and > > fixed. > > I'm not saying this would be impossible, but there are still a lot > of unsolved issues in this which are not solved in Open Source. > > Note that for performance reasons the binaries & libraries on the > device are prelinked. This is not automatically done when some > package is updated (would take too long time etc). I.e. with the > central library package update, your device will get slower + use more > Flash and RAM. > > Also, on a mobile device, it's much more likely that the battery runs > out, or drops out (if user is a bit thoughtless). If this happens when > you're running dist-upgrade, you've bricked your device. > > On a mobile device it can easily happen that there's not enough free > space to do dist-upgrade. I haven't tested it, but I don't think > dpkg/apt handle dist-upgrade running out of space. Once again, > consumer would have bricked her device. > > Except maybe for the time taken to do backup & restore, re-flashing > the device is both faster and easier than dist-upgrade. The backup & > restore could be improved somewhat, especially in regards to application > installer though. Automatic restoring of packages after reflashing > could be risky though. > > > The advantage of opensource is in its flexibility and customisation. > > Nokia have negated this by imposing a very rigid structure around the > > 770. That's fine in itself, but don't pitch the device as opensource > > and be surprised when people get annoyed with the lack of control they > > have over it. > > > > Luckily for me, the one application I use very regularly, the > > opensource FBreader, is highly stable. Otherwise I'd get very annoyed > > with the device. > > - Eero > > _______________________________________________ > maemo-users mailing list > maemo-users at maemo.org > https://maemo.org/mailman/listinfo/maemo-users
