Fwd: Downloading tracks from gps via usb

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I apologise if this is a duplicate I had a bounce back from the list
due to it since I had inadvertently included HTML. So I am resending.

To: Alan Stern <stern@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>
Cc: USB list <linux-usb@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>

Alan,

I have looked through the strace output the following excerpt below
directly includes references gebabbel. Is this more in line with what
you were expecting it to reveal? I can of course send the full file to
anyone interested in the complete output. It is too large to insert
into an e-mail and there is a lot of repetition of my original
excerpt.

Good point about ubuntu forums. This issue is also question #293560 on
the forum https://answers.launchpad.net/ubuntu

Stephen



0.000428 lstat("/home/stephen/.config/Gebabbel/GebabbelSystemSettings-0.4.ini",
{st_mode=S_IFREG|0664, st_size=104555, ...}) = 0
     0.000553 stat("/home/stephen/.config/Gebabbel/GebabbelSystemSettings-0.4.ini",
{st_mode=S_IFREG|0664, st_size=104555, ...}) = 0
     0.000458 open("/home/stephen/.config/Gebabbel/GebabbelSystemSettings-0.4.ini",
O_RDWR|O_CREAT|O_CLOEXEC, 0666) = 16
     0.000377 fcntl(16, F_SETFD, FD_CLOEXEC) = 0
     0.000282 close(16)                 = 0
     0.000458 open("/home/stephen/.config/Gebabbel/GebabbelSystemSettings-0.4.ini",
O_RDWR|O_CREAT|O_CLOEXEC, 0666) = 16
     0.000333 fcntl(16, F_SETFD, FD_CLOEXEC) = 0
     0.000170 fstatfs(16, {f_type="EXT2_SUPER_MAGIC", f_bsize=4096,
f_blocks=13662317, f_bfree=10208259, f_bavail=9508483,
f_files=3481600, f_ffree=3018918, f_fsid={-1325636568, -503947512},
f_namelen=255, f_frsize=4096}) = 0
     0.000205 fcntl(16, F_SETLKW, {type=F_WRLCK, whence=SEEK_SET,
start=0, len=0}) = 0
     0.000251 stat("/home/stephen/.config/Gebabbel/GebabbelSystemSettings-0.4.ini",
{st_mode=S_IFREG|0664, st_size=104555, ...}) = 0
     0.000292 stat("/etc/localtime", {st_mode=S_IFREG|0644,
st_size=3661, ...}) = 0
     0.003298 lseek(16, 0, SEEK_CUR)    = 0
     0.000260 ftruncate(16, 0)          = 0
     0.001091 brk(0xf8d000)             = 0xf8d000
     0.003249 brk(0xfae000)             = 0xfae000
     0.001288 fstat(16, {st_mode=S_IFREG|0664, st_size=0, ...}) = 0
     0.001851 write(16, "[General]\nGebabbelVersion=0.4\nUs"..., 16347) = 16347
     0.002451 write(16, "kwf2\\Options\\snlen%3D=Forbids (0"..., 16332) = 16332
     0.008573 write(16, "compegps\\Options\\index%3D=\"If th"..., 16369) = 16369
     0.001738 write(16, "gpsman\\Options\\snwhite%3D=Forbid"..., 16172) = 16172
     0.003755 write(16, "text\\Options\\degformat%3D=\"Defin"..., 16327) = 16327
     0.001815 write(16, "ISO-8859-10=\"csISOLatin6, ISO885"..., 16370) = 16370
     0.002678 stat("/home/stephen/.config/Gebabbel/GebabbelSystemSettings-0.4.ini",
{st_mode=S_IFREG|0664, st_size=97917, ...}) = 0
     0.000341 stat("/etc/localtime", {st_mode=S_IFREG|0644,
st_size=3661, ...}) = 0
     0.000269 write(16, "Cannot%20open%20shp%20file=An er"..., 6638) = 6638
     0.000313 close(16)                 = 0
     0.000606 lstat("/home/stephen/.config/Gebabbel.ini",
0x7ffe93f30fc0) = -1 ENOENT (No such file or directory)
     0.000267 open("/home/stephen/.config/Gebabbel.ini",
O_RDONLY|O_CLOEXEC) = -1 ENOENT (No such file or directory)
     0.000263 stat("/home/stephen/.config/Gebabbel.ini",
0x7ffe93f31030) = -1 ENOENT (No such file or directory)
     0.000239 stat("/etc/localtime", {st_mode=S_IFREG|0644,
st_size=3661, ...}) = 0
     0.000408 lstat("/etc/xdg/Gebabbel/GebabbelSystemSettings-0.4.ini",
0x7ffe93f30fc0) = -1 ENOENT (No such file or directory)
     0.000277 open("/etc/xdg/Gebabbel/GebabbelSystemSettings-0.4.ini",
O_RDONLY|O_CLOEXEC) = -1 ENOENT (No such file or directory)
     0.000282 stat("/etc/xdg/Gebabbel/GebabbelSystemSettings-0.4.ini",
0x7ffe93f31030) = -1 ENOENT (No such file or directory)
     0.000261 stat("/etc/localtime", {st_mode=S_IFREG|0644,
st_size=3661, ...}) = 0
     0.000347 lstat("/etc/xdg/Gebabbel.ini", 0x7ffe93f30fc0) = -1
ENOENT (No such file or directory)
     0.000282 open("/etc/xdg/Gebabbel.ini", O_RDONLY|O_CLOEXEC) = -1
ENOENT (No such file or directory)
     0.000284 stat("/etc/xdg/Gebabbel.ini", 0x7ffe93f31030) = -1
ENOENT (No such file or directory)
     0.000235 stat("/etc/localtime", {st_mode=S_IFREG|0644,
st_size=3661, ...}) = 0
     0.000350 lstat("/home/stephen/.config/Gebabbel/GebabbelSystemSettings-0.4.ini",
{st_mode=S_IFREG|0664, st_size=104555, ...}) = 0
     0.000400 stat("/home/stephen/.config/Gebabbel/GebabbelSystemSettings-0.4.ini",
{st_mode=S_IFREG|0664, st_size=104555, ...}) = 0
     0.000304 open("/home/stephen/.config/Gebabbel/GebabbelSystemSettings-0.4.ini",
O_RDWR|O_CREAT|O_CLOEXEC, 0666) = 16
     0.000253 fcntl(16, F_SETFD, FD_CLOEXEC) = 0
     0.000181 close(16)                 = 0
     0.000216 open("/home/stephen/.config/Gebabbel/GebabbelSystemSettings-0.4.ini",
O_RDWR|O_CREAT|O_CLOEXEC, 0666) = 16
     0.000360 fcntl(16, F_SETFD, FD_CLOEXEC) = 0
     0.000192 fstatfs(16, {f_type="EXT2_SUPER_MAGIC", f_bsize=4096,
f_blocks=13662317, f_bfree=10208258, f_bavail=9508482,
f_files=3481600, f_ffree=3018918, f_fsid={-1325636568, -503947512},
f_namelen=255, f_frsize=4096}) = 0
     0.000226 fcntl(16, F_SETLKW, {type=F_WRLCK, whence=SEEK_SET,
start=0, len=0}) = 0
     0.000251 stat("/home/stephen/.config/Gebabbel/GebabbelSystemSettings-0.4.ini",
{st_mode=S_IFREG|0664, st_size=104555, ...}) = 0
     0.001334 fstat(16, {st_mode=S_IFREG|0664, st_size=104555, ...}) = 0
     0.000261 fstat(16, {st_mode=S_IFREG|0664, st_size=104555, ...}) = 0
     0.002252 read(16, "[General]\nGebabbelVersion=0.4\nUs"..., 104555) = 104555
     0.001746 stat("/etc/localtime", {st_mode=S_IFREG|0644,
st_size=3661, ...}) = 0
     0.015024 lseek(16, 0, SEEK_SET)    = 0
     0.000300 lseek(16, 0, SEEK_CUR)    = 0
     0.000179 ftruncate(16, 0)          = 0
     0.005453 write(16, "[General]\nGebabbelVersion=0.4\nUs"..., 16347) = 16347
     0.001749 write(16, "kwf2\\Options\\snlen%3D=Forbids (0"..., 16332) = 16332
     0.001616 write(16, "compegps\\Options\\index%3D=\"If th"..., 16369) = 16369
     0.001744 write(16, "gpsman\\Options\\snwhite%3D=Forbid"..., 16172) = 16172
     0.001793 write(16, "text\\Options\\degformat%3D=\"Defin"..., 16327) = 16327
     0.001851 write(16, "ISO-8859-10=\"csISOLatin6, ISO885"..., 16370) = 16370
     0.002689 stat("/home/stephen/.config/Gebabbel/GebabbelSystemSettings-0.4.ini",
{st_mode=S_IFREG|0664, st_size=97917, ...}) = 0
     0.000336 stat("/etc/localtime", {st_mode=S_IFREG|0644,
st_size=3661, ...}) = 0
     0.000247 write(16, "Cannot%20open%20shp%20file=An er"..., 6638) = 6638
     0.000307 close(16)                 = 0
     0.000656 lstat("/home/stephen/.config/Gebabbel.ini",
0x7ffe93f30fc0) = -1 ENOENT (No such file or directory)
     0.000277 open("/home/stephen/.config/Gebabbel.ini",
O_RDONLY|O_CLOEXEC) = -1 ENOENT (No such file or directory)
     0.000284 stat("/home/stephen/.config/Gebabbel.ini",
0x7ffe93f31030) = -1 ENOENT (No such file or directory)
     0.000248 stat("/etc/localtime", {st_mode=S_IFREG|0644,
st_size=3661, ...}) = 0
     0.000270 lstat("/etc/xdg/Gebabbel/GebabbelSystemSettings-0.4.ini",
0x7ffe93f30fc0) = -1 ENOENT (No such file or directory)
     0.000210 open("/etc/xdg/Gebabbel/GebabbelSystemSettings-0.4.ini",
O_RDONLY|O_CLOEXEC) = -1 ENOENT (No such file or directory)
     0.000273 stat("/etc/xdg/Gebabbel/GebabbelSystemSettings-0.4.ini",
0x7ffe93f31030) = -1 ENOENT (No such file or directory)
     0.000250 stat("/etc/localtime", {st_mode=S_IFREG|0644,
st_size=3661, ...}) = 0
     0.000311 lstat("/etc/xdg/Gebabbel.ini", 0x7ffe93f30fc0) = -1
ENOENT (No such file or directory)
     0.000254 open("/etc/xdg/Gebabbel.ini", O_RDONLY|O_CLOEXEC) = -1
ENOENT (No such file or directory)
     0.000270 stat("/etc/xdg/Gebabbel.ini", 0x7ffe93f31030) = -1
ENOENT (No such file or directory)
     0.000234 stat("/etc/localtime", {st_mode=S_IFREG|0644,
st_size=3661, ...}) = 0
     0.000385 write(0, "\1\0\0\0\0\0\0\0", 8) = 8
     0.000289 lstat("/home/stephen/.config/Gebabbel/GebabbelUserSettings.ini",
{st_mode=S_IFREG|0664, st_size=5850, ...}) = 0
     0.000404 stat("/home/stephen/.config/Gebabbel/GebabbelUserSettings.ini",
{st_mode=S_IFREG|0664, st_size=5850, ...}) = 0
     0.000330 open("/home/stephen/.config/Gebabbel/GebabbelUserSettings.ini",
O_RDWR|O_CREAT|O_CLOEXEC, 0666) = 16
     0.000301 fcntl(16, F_SETFD, FD_CLOEXEC) = 0
     0.000206 close(16)                 = 0
     0.000349 open("/home/stephen/.config/Gebabbel/GebabbelUserSettings.ini",
O_RDWR|O_CREAT|O_CLOEXEC, 0666) = 16
     0.000328 fcntl(16, F_SETFD, FD_CLOEXEC) = 0
     0.000188 fstatfs(16, {f_type="EXT2_SUPER_MAGIC", f_bsize=4096,
f_blocks=13662317, f_bfree=10208257, f_bavail=9508481,
f_files=3481600, f_ffree=3018918, f_fsid={-1325636568, -503947512},
f_namelen=255, f_frsize=4096}) = 0
     0.000219 fcntl(16, F_SETLKW, {type=F_WRLCK, whence=SEEK_SET,
start=0, len=0}) = 0
     0.000282 stat("/home/stephen/.config/Gebabbel/GebabbelUserSettings.ini",
{st_mode=S_IFREG|0664, st_size=5850, ...}) = 0
     0.000380 stat("/etc/localtime", {st_mode=S_IFREG|0644,
st_size=3661, ...}) = 0
     0.000409 lseek(16, 0, SEEK_CUR)    = 0
     0.000215 ftruncate(16, 0)          = 0
     0.000794 fstat(16, {st_mode=S_IFREG|0664, st_size=0, ...}) = 0
     0.002315 stat("/home/stephen/.config/Gebabbel/GebabbelUserSettings.ini",
{st_mode=S_IFREG|0664, st_size=0, ...}) = 0
     0.000476 stat("/etc/localtime", {st_mode=S_IFREG|0644,
st_size=3661, ...}) = 0
     0.000324 write(16, "[General]\nGpsbabelPath=gpsbabel\n"..., 5850) = 5850
     0.000390 close(16)                 = 0
     0.000676 lstat("/home/stephen/.config/Gebabbel.ini",
0x7ffe93f30f40) = -1 ENOENT (No such file or directory)
     0.000331 open("/home/stephen/.config/Gebabbel.ini",
O_RDONLY|O_CLOEXEC) = -1 ENOENT (No such file or directory)
     0.000301 stat("/home/stephen/.config/Gebabbel.ini",
0x7ffe93f30fb0) = -1 ENOENT (No such file or directory)
     0.000268 stat("/etc/localtime", {st_mode=S_IFREG|0644,
st_size=3661, ...}) = 0
     0.001063 lstat("/etc/xdg/Gebabbel/GebabbelUserSettings.ini",
0x7ffe93f30f40) = -1 ENOENT (No such file or directory)
     0.000292 open("/etc/xdg/Gebabbel/GebabbelUserSettings.ini",
O_RDONLY|O_CLOEXEC) = -1 ENOENT (No such file or directory)
     0.000261 stat("/etc/xdg/Gebabbel/GebabbelUserSettings.ini",
0x7ffe93f30fb0) = -1 ENOENT (No such file or directory)
     0.000263 stat("/etc/localtime", {st_mode=S_IFREG|0644,
st_size=3661, ...}) = 0
     0.000335 lstat("/etc/xdg/Gebabbel.ini", 0x7ffe93f30f40) = -1
ENOENT (No such file or directory)
     0.000267 open("/etc/xdg/Gebabbel.ini", O_RDONLY|O_CLOEXEC) = -1
ENOENT (No such file or directory)
     0.000397 stat("/etc/xdg/Gebabbel.ini", 0x7ffe93f30fb0) = -1
ENOENT (No such file or directory)
     0.000264 stat("/etc/localtime", {st_mode=S_IFREG|0644,
st_size=3661, ...}) = 0
     0.001723 stat("usb:", 0x7ffe93f30be0) = -1 ENOENT (No such file
or directory)
     0.001498 stat("/home/stephen/Desktop/GarminTracks.gpx",
0x7ffe93f30be0) = -1 ENOENT (No such file or directory)
     0.006618 write(0, "\1\0\0\0\0\0\0\0", 8) = 8
     0.000422 write(0, "\1\0\0\0\0\0\0\0", 8) = 8



On Thu, May 12, 2016 at 9:39 PM, Alan Stern <stern@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx> wrote:
>
> You should use Reply-To-All so that your email goes to the mailing list
> as well as to me.
>
> On Thu, 12 May 2016, Stephen Furner wrote:
>
> > Alan,
> >
> > The following is an excerpt from strace output for gebabbel when
> > asking it to call the file from the gps. It has the relative time
> > stamp on each line. The full output text file for the trace of a
> > request to download from is about 500k.
>
> The portion you extracted doesn't seem to be relevant to your problem.
>
> > I currently believe this is a permissions issue from the way ubuntu
> > implements root privileges. Running babel from the console window as a
> > sudo line command I can get it to dowload the traks from the GPS.
> > However, using the graphical user interfaces of gebabbel or viking I
> > just get error messages.
>
> What are the permissions for /dev/bus/usb/003/003 (substitute the
> appropriate values for the bus and device numbers)?
>
> > Sadly moving from text based line commands to a GUI has not in this
> > case improved ease of use on this installation.
>
> You may get better help from an Ubuntu support forum or mailing list.
>
> Alan Stern
>
> > Stephen
> >
> >     0.000000 restart_syscall(<... resuming interrupted call ...>) = 1
> >      1.163207 recvmsg(5, {msg_name(0)=NULL, msg_iov(1)=[{"\241
> > \270\2\3\0\240\0033\1\0\0@\1\0\0F\34\0\0\3\0\240\3\0\0\0\0\0\0\0\0",
> > 4096}], msg_controllen=0, msg_flags=0}, 0) = 32
> >      0.000319 recvmsg(5, 0x7ffe93f31120, 0) = -1 EAGAIN (Resource
> > temporarily unavailable)
> >      0.000331 poll([{fd=5, events=POLLIN|POLLOUT}], 1, 4294967295) = 1
> > ([{fd=5, revents=POLLOUT}])
> >      0.000317 writev(5, [{"\31\0\v\0~\0\0\0\0\0\30\0!
> > \0\0~\0\0\0003\1\0\0@\1\0\0F\34\0\0"..., 44}, {NULL, 0}, {"", 0}], 3)
> > = 44
> >      0.000297 recvmsg(5, 0x7ffe93f30f30, 0) = -1 EAGAIN (Resource
> > temporarily unavailable)
> >      0.000233 recvmsg(5, 0x7ffe93f31100, 0) = -1 EAGAIN (Resource
> > temporarily unavailable)
> >      0.000204 recvmsg(7, 0x7ffe93f310f0, 0) = -1 EAGAIN (Resource
> > temporarily unavailable)
> >      0.000187 poll([{fd=0, events=POLLIN}, {fd=6, events=POLLIN},
> > {fd=7, events=POLLIN}, {fd=14, events=POLLIN}, {fd=5, events=POLLIN},
> > {fd=15, events=POLLIN}], 6, 2155) = 0 (Timeout)
> >      2.157916 recvmsg(5, 0x7ffe93f31120, 0) = -1 EAGAIN (Resource
> > temporarily unavailable)
> >      0.000324 recvmsg(5, 0x7ffe93f31100, 0) = -1 EAGAIN (Resource
> > temporarily unavailable)
> >      0.000204 recvmsg(7, 0x7ffe93f310f0, 0) = -1 EAGAIN (Resource
> > temporarily unavailable)
> >      0.000184 poll([{fd=0, events=POLLIN}, {fd=6, events=POLLIN},
> > {fd=7, events=POLLIN}, {fd=14, events=POLLIN}, {fd=5, events=POLLIN},
> > {fd=15, events=POLLIN}], 6, 9999) = 1 ([{fd=5, revents=POLLIN}])
> >      3.237960 recvmsg(5, {msg_name(0)=NULL, msg_iov(1)=[{"\241
> > \271\2\3\0\240\0033\1\0\0@\1\0\0G\34\0\0\3\0\240\3\0\0\0\0\0\0\0\0",
> > 4096}], msg_controllen=0, msg_flags=0}, 0) = 32
> >      0.000433 recvmsg(5, 0x7ffe93f31120, 0) = -1 EAGAIN (Resource
> > temporarily unavailable)
> >      0.000354 poll([{fd=5, events=POLLIN|POLLOUT}], 1, 4294967295) = 1
> > ([{fd=5, revents=POLLOUT}])
> >      0.000411 writev(5, [{"\31\0\v\0~\0\0\0\0\0\30\0!
> > \0\0~\0\0\0003\1\0\0@\1\0\0G\34\0\0"..., 44}, {NULL, 0}, {"", 0}], 3)
> > = 44
> >      0.000418 recvmsg(5, 0x7ffe93f30f30, 0) = -1 EAGAIN (Resource
> > temporarily unavailable)
> >      0.000342 recvmsg(5, 0x7ffe93f31100, 0) = -1 EAGAIN (Resource
> > temporarily unavailable)
> >      0.000415 recvmsg(7, 0x7ffe93f310f0, 0) = -1 EAGAIN (Resource
> > temporarily unavailable)
> >      0.000348 poll([{fd=0, events=POLLIN}, {fd=6, events=POLLIN},
> > {fd=7, events=POLLIN}, {fd=14, events=POLLIN}, {fd=5, events=POLLIN},
> > {fd=15, events=POLLIN}], 6, 6759) = 1 ([{fd=5, revents=POLLIN}])
> >      1.964307 recvmsg(5, {msg_name(0)=NULL,
> > msg_iov(1)=[{"\7\3\272\2\201D>\2~\0\0\0\3\0\240\3\0\0\0\0\31\3\323\1\211\2<\1\0\0\0\2"...,
> > 4096}], msg_controllen=0, msg_flags=0}, 0) = 96
> >      0.000271 recvmsg(5, 0x7ffe93f31120, 0) = -1 EAGAIN (Resource
> > temporarily unavailable)
> >      0.000234 poll([{fd=5, events=POLLIN|POLLOUT}], 1, 4294967295) = 1
> > ([{fd=5, revents=POLLOUT}])
> >      0.000219 writev(5, [{"&\0\2\0~\0\0\0", 8}, {NULL, 0}, {"", 0}], 3) = 8
> >      0.000246 poll([{fd=5, events=POLLIN}], 1, 4294967295) = 1
> > ([{fd=5, revents=POLLIN}])
> >      0.001168 recvmsg(5, {msg_name(0)=NULL,
> > msg_iov(1)=[{"\1\1\273\2\0\0\0\0~\0\0\0\16c\302\1\31\3\323\1\31\3\323\1\0\0\0\0\0\0\0\0",
> > 4096}], msg_controllen=0, msg_flags=0}, 0) = 32
> >      0.000245 recvmsg(5, 0x7ffe93f30b10, 0) = -1 EAGAIN (Resource
> > temporarily unavailable)
> >
> > . . .
> >
> > On Thu, May 12, 2016 at 9:06 PM, Stephen Furner
> > <stephen.furner@xxxxxxxxxxxxxx> wrote:
> > > On Thu, May 12, 2016 at 6:53 PM, Alan Stern <stern@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx> wrote:
> > >> On Wed, 11 May 2016, Stephen Furner wrote:
> > >>
> > >>> The kernel is: 3.19.0-59-generic
> > >>>
> > >>> Listing the USB devices I see:
> > >>>
> > >>> stephen@stephen-N150P:~$ lsusb
> > >>> Bus 001 Device 004: ID 0ac8:c33f Z-Star Microelectronics Corp. Webcam
> > >>> Bus 001 Device 003: ID 0781:5567 SanDisk Corp. Cruzer Blade
> > >>> Bus 001 Device 001: ID 1d6b:0002 Linux Foundation 2.0 root hub
> > >>> Bus 005 Device 001: ID 1d6b:0001 Linux Foundation 1.1 root hub
> > >>> Bus 004 Device 001: ID 1d6b:0001 Linux Foundation 1.1 root hub
> > >>> Bus 003 Device 002: ID 0a5c:219c Broadcom Corp.
> > >>> Bus 003 Device 003: ID 091e:0003 Garmin International GPS (various models)
> > >>> Bus 003 Device 001: ID 1d6b:0001 Linux Foundation 1.1 root hub
> > >>> Bus 002 Device 001: ID 1d6b:0001 Linux Foundation 1.1 root hub
> > >>>
> > >>> The catalogue output from the usb debug is:
> > >>
> > >> ...
> > >>> T: Bus=03 Lev=01 Prnt=01 Port=00 Cnt=01 Dev#= 3 Spd=12 MxCh= 0
> > >>> D: Ver= 1.10 Cls=ff(vend.) Sub=ff Prot=ff MxPS= 8 #Cfgs= 1
> > >>> P: Vendor=091e ProdID=0003 Rev= 0.01
> > >>> C:* #Ifs= 1 Cfg#= 1 Atr=c0 MxPwr= 0mA
> > >>> I:* If#= 0 Alt= 0 #EPs= 3 Cls=ff(vend.) Sub=ff Prot=ff Driver=(none)
> > >>> E: Ad=81(I) Atr=03(Int.) MxPS= 64 Ivl=1ms
> > >>> E: Ad=02(O) Atr=02(Bulk) MxPS= 64 Ivl=0ms
> > >>> E: Ad=83(I) Atr=02(Bulk) MxPS= 8 Ivl=0ms
> > >> ...
> > >>
> > >> That doesn't say very much, but at least it proves that no other driver
> > >> has claimed the interface.
> > >>
> > >> The next thing you can try is to run the Gebabbel program under strace
> > >> and send the output to a file.  That should tell us exactly what
> > >> Gebabbel is trying unsuccessfully to do.
> > >>
> > >> Alan Stern
> > >>
> >
>
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