Thanx Shane: I'll look these over more closely and probably apply them. The raw keyboard macro was a silly oversight. I am however totally rewriting keyboard.c interaction so things will change there again soon. Applying the first patch may not make is necessary to have loadkeys in the speakup case but will still bomb because loadkeys is needed to compile the kernel the first time in anycase so I'm not sure we've fixed anything or just moved the problem. Kirk -- Kirk Reiser The Computer Braille Facility e-mail: kirk at braille.uwo.ca University of Western Ontario phone: (519) 661-3061