On Tue, 2010-02-23 at 10:33 -0500, Andy Walls wrote: > On Tue, 2010-02-23 at 15:41 +0100, Hans Verkuil wrote: > > > On Tue, 2010-02-23 at 08:53 +0100, Hans Verkuil wrote: > > >> On Monday 22 February 2010 23:00:32 Devin Heitmueller wrote: > > >> > On Mon, Feb 22, 2010 at 4:54 PM, Hans Verkuil <hverkuil@xxxxxxxxx> > > >> wrote: > > > > > >> > Of course, if you and Mauro wanted to sign off on the creation of a > > >> > new non-private user control called V4L2_CID_CHROMA_GAIN, that would > > >> > also resolve my problem. :-) > > >> > > >> Hmm, Mauro is right: the color controls we have now are a bit of a mess. > > >> Perhaps this is a good moment to try and fix them. Suppose we had no > > >> color > > >> controls at all: how would we design them in that case? When we know > > >> what we > > >> really need, then we can compare that with what we have and figure out > > >> what > > >> we need to do to make things right again. > > > Let me rephrase my question: how would you design the user color controls? > > > E.g., the controls that are exported in GUIs to the average user. > > Look at the knobs on an old TV or look at the menu on more modern > televisions: > > 1. Hue (or Tint) (at least NTSC TVs have this control) > 2. Brightness > 3. Saturation > > These are the three parameters to which the Human Visual System > sensitive. > > Any other controls are fixing problems that the hardware can't seem to > get right on it's own - right? Bah, I forgot contrast. Regards, Andy > > > Most of > > the controls you mentioned above are meaningless to most users. When we > > have subdev device nodes, then such controls can become accessible to > > applications to do fine-tuning, but they do not belong in a GUI in e.g. > > tvtime or xawtv. > > > > The problem is of course in that grey area between obviously user-level > > controls like brightness and obviously (to me at least) expert-level > > controls like chroma coring. > > Right, so an expert can see colors bleeding to the side in portions of > the image and guess that it's a comb filter problem. What's my recourse > at that point, when I see such a clip submitted from user and identify > it's a comb filter problem? "Tough, you're not an expert, so I can't > give you manual control over the comb filter so you can fix your > problem" ? > > Also, just because a user can't guess what to do, doesn't mean they are > incapable of "mashing buttons" until they find something that works. I > don't quite see the value in restricting controls from users, when the > only consequence of such restriction is them coming back here asking > what else they can try to solve a problem. It's frustrating to have a > setting on the chip that could fix a user problem and knowing there is > no control coded up for it. It just makes the debug cycle longer. > > > What is the benefit to us or to end users for denying controls to > non-expert users? > > > OK, I'm done ranting now. :) > > Regards, > Andy > > > -- > To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe linux-media" in > the body of a message to majordomo@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx > More majordomo info at http://vger.kernel.org/majordomo-info.html > -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe linux-media" in the body of a message to majordomo@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx More majordomo info at http://vger.kernel.org/majordomo-info.html
