On Fri 2009-09-04 07:49:34, Ric Wheeler wrote: > On 09/04/2009 03:44 AM, Rob Landley wrote: >> On Thursday 03 September 2009 09:14:43 jim owens wrote: >> >>> Rob Landley wrote: >>> >>>> I think he understands he was clueless too, that's why he investigated >>>> the failure and wrote it up for posterity. >>>> >>>> >>>>> And Ric said do not stigmatize whole classes of A) devices, B) raid, >>>>> and C) filesystems with "Pavel says...". >>>>> >>>> I don't care what "Pavel says", so you can leave the ad hominem at the >>>> door, thanks. >>>> >>> See, this is exactly the problem we have with all the proposed >>> documentation. The reader (you) did not get what the writer (me) >>> was trying to say. That does not say either of us was wrong in >>> what we thought was meant, simply that we did not communicate. >>> >> That's why I've mostly stopped bothering with this thread. I could respond to >> Ric Wheeler's latest (what does write barriers have to do with whether or not >> a multi-sector stripe is guaranteed to be atomically updated during a panic or >> power failure?) but there's just no point. >> > > The point of that post was that the failure that you and Pavel both > attribute to RAID and journalled fs happens whenever the storage cannot > promise to do atomic writes of a logical FS block (prevent torn > pages/split writes/etc). I gave a specific example of why this happens > even with simple, single disk systems. ext3 does not expect atomic write of 4K block, according to Ted. So no, it is not broken on single disk. >> The LWN article on the topic is out, and incomplete as it is I expect it's the >> best documentation anybody will actually _read_. Would anyone (probably privately?) share the lwn link? Pavel -- (english) http://www.livejournal.com/~pavelmachek (cesky, pictures) http://atrey.karlin.mff.cuni.cz/~pavel/picture/horses/blog.html -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe linux-ext4" in the body of a message to majordomo@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx More majordomo info at http://vger.kernel.org/majordomo-info.html
