-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- Hash: SHA1 Am 10.05.2010 22:20, schrieb fons@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx: > On Mon, May 10, 2010 at 08:31:46PM +0200, Hartmut Noack wrote: > >> I do not say and I find it hard to imagine, that Lennart does not know >> about pro-audio needs. But he does not seem to give it any particular >> high priority. > > Which is logical, as it is not his priority. But neither does he > ignore pro-audio. And distro-vendors do not have such a priority either. But audio-production is a standard-feature for Mac and Windows so in my humble oppinion: Linux will never be considered a mature universal usable operating system if it does not support audio-production. To set up any standard-Linux for that task is done in a matter of minutes today and it makes my stomach turn seeing that distributors are not giving even that little effort to make it possible. A little post-install script for a jack-package that sets up group audio and limits.conf. Ubuntu actually tries to do that but fails to put the user into group audio and to set memlock. And if there would be a graphical, well documented tool easy to be found and easy to operate tool to setup PA, everything could become much much easier and the hatred would fade... >> But facts are facts: most pro-audio people hate PA. >> And this hatred: >> >> 1) cannot exist whithout any reason >> 2) is harmfull and should be stopped by eliminating these reasons. > > As one who has commented on PA before I may be allowed to say this: > > I do *not* hate PA. I just don't need it, since I do not want any > 'desktop' sounds on my machines, and I expect to be able to set up > a system without PA just as I can set up one without CUPS, or without > RAID, or replace Sendmail by Postfix, or in general choose whatever > subsystems I actually need. > > What I *do* hate is that this has become near impossible with major > distros, since the way they set up 'a destop system' makes almost > everything depend on everything else, regardless of such dependencies > being real or not. A mail program is still fully functional even if > it doesn't start singing whenever a message arrives, and it should be > installable without any dependency on anything audio. > > That this is not the case is not Lennart's fault. That he actually > seems to advocate this type of distro policies is another matter, > I can't explain it on rational grounds, and it is the main reason > behind my negative reactions towards him at some time. > > Apart from that, *if* you want 'desktop sound' then PA is probably > the best thing since sliced bread. This I argee absolutely. PA has the potential to solve all the trouble with Linux Audio on the desktop for good. > I was *very* surprised to learn > that PA at the moment does not have a native API, at least not one > Lennart would want to advocate. PA would gain a lot of appeal by > providing that. > > Regarding user ignorance of PA's qualities and configuration options, > that is partly the result of what the 'desktop movement' aims to > provide. If everything is designed to be automatic and zeroconf > then the logical result will be ignorant users. Again I agree from the heart. I filed a bug report in ubuntus launchpad some years ago, complaining, that startup-messages are not displayed anymore but only a MacOSXish progress-animation. The Ubuntu-people answered that "thousands of users" had complained about "scary messages scrolling by at startup". So they removed them. We then found an agreement that hitting SPACE or ESC should display the messages for those, who are not so scared about informations about the startup process. But still you can only change to another console to see whats happening in UBUNTU as it starts. best regards HZN > > Ciao, > -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: GnuPG v2.0.12 (GNU/Linux) Comment: Using GnuPG with SUSE - http://enigmail.mozdev.org/ iEYEARECAAYFAkvoegEACgkQ1Aecwva1SWMpdQCdFPTfnhU19U/xk6nYbH5CLWZZ iAUAniLuovQGxWyZ/SM98s/ei0+13TSV =3l9/ -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- _______________________________________________ Linux-audio-user mailing list Linux-audio-user@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx http://lists.linuxaudio.org/listinfo/linux-audio-user
