On Sat, May 9, 2009 at 2:11 AM, Mark Knecht <markknecht@xxxxxxxxx> wrote: >> I had a quick mess around with a bus with TAP reverb, and only 1 >> reverb.. It gave the track a more "live" sound to my ears - more >> real maybe, but lacking some of the dynamics of a studio >> recording.. any idea where I am going wrong? >A > Absolutely impossible for me to tell from a simple email. Possibly you > are expecting too much at this point in the process? Maybe it's real. > We can talk through it, for weeks. I like this stuff. It hardly gets > discussed around here. I am all for more. That's really great. Thanks for taking the time with this. > OK, breaking it down, how does the room compare to your studio > experience? More bunker-ish, less studio-like! Room has reflective concrete walls, I am using the PA mixer to mix the mics, Although turned down very low, there is also the PA output coming back into the room!! (is there a way around this without buying my own mixing board?? - I guessed that disconnecting the speakers from the PA might not be very advisable for the health of the amplifier??) > How do the mics compare? I have a condenser mic (Samson C01) which I could not use because of the feedback from the PA. Everything was recorded with 1 or 2 Shure sm58s Don't assume that inexpensive > mics will give an inexpensive sound. Don't assume that any personal > inexperience means you must do worse than an experienced studio tech. > But do understand it's harder for you at home to approach the results > you'll get recording at Electric Ladyland with someone who's made 100 > albums. Just keep at it. > > As for reverbs, they all sound different and it really takes some > experimentation to find ones that you like. Jumping ahead, I head a > LOT of things going on in your studio recording. If you're trying to > duplicate that in the work you're doing at home then that will take > some work to write down what the major components are in the sound and > then working on each one , one by one. > >> >> How about compression? Is it OK to run 2 compressors in parallel >> like the C* and Satan Maximizer, or is it just a waste of >> resources? > > Well, I'd want to ask why you're using a compressor? I have a *strong* > impression why, listening to the mp3, but I don't know what your > current recording sounds like. (It is different, correct?) > > My initial guess, and it's just a guess, is that you my be falling > prey to the two things most people do : > > 1) tracking WAY too loud. > 2) Using boost instead of cut in your EQ. Yes. I think you are right here. > > > OK, this girl can sing, and I really shouldn't call her a girl 'cause > everything about her sound was full grown woman. Great voice. Sexy. > Confident. I did find myself wishing she really got edgy or even a bit > mean somewhere in the mix, but that can be in some other song. Loved > the line about lemon bitters. The playing was competent and fit the > song well. Very present. Not compressed. The engineer used positioning > tricks, not volume, to help bring the guitars forward at different > times. Chris Isaak comes to mind for me. > > The overall tracking here sounds pretty clean to me, but the mix > doesn't. It's WAY too loud on my system. It must be 6-9db louder than > anything else I compared it with. Maybe that's just the way the mp3 > got made. Keep in mind that it's VERY important to make comparisons at > the same volume. I hear a lot of clipping and clicking, even when I > turn it down, so that's not good at all. Hmm.. I certainly heard some clicks that were there from the original studio recording (on the vocal track IIRC). These have been made louder by the mixing/mastering process. Is there anything that can be done about these kinds of problems (assuming it's not possible to re-record a better version)? > I get the impression that your first issue is tracking. Definitely, but I have to do the best I can with less than ideal equipment - the main problem being how to mix down to 2 tracks to record without a mixer that is not the PA! I do also have a cheap microphone amp - so I could make single mic recordings without using the PA, but this seems less than ideal for drums!? > To me compressors are things I don't use until I have a reason (read > problem) to use them. Note that most of my stuff is more natural > jazz/rock/pop. I've done a couple of Big Band CDs for friends. Live > Big Band is tough and compressors there were necessary during tracking > to get it on disk. Electronica could be very different. > > Barry's Satan whatever is to help create a specific sound. That's > fine. It might be added later, or used during tracking. Whatever gets > you the sound on the track you are looking for. > > Generally speaking reverb is for me something I try to hold off using > at all until the MIX gets underway. The longer I listen dry the > happier I generally am when I finally add it. > > I suppose what I'm saying as I run out of energy (I'm sick, bummer for > me) is that I think you should really focus now on tracking your > guitar or recording her vocal, and getting just that track to have a > good sound. I understand that sometimes vocalist require reverb to do > their job, but as the engineer you want to focus on how the voice > sounds. Send the reverb to her headphones, not your speakers as much > as possible, Are you capturing what she sounds like? Is it technically > good. Play with mic distance, different breath screens, different > mics. Sit in the room with her while she sings, assuming you're not > using a booth. Ask her what she thinks of her sound. In my experience > finding something that works at the track level leads to better mixes, > and better mixes lead to easier mastering. > > And, cut, cut, cut, not boost. > > Hope this helps, Fantastically useful! One thing I was considering, if you are amenable, is to post both songs in their raw (ardour) form - the first (professional-ish) one was done in protools, but I have imported individual audio tracks into ardour and have got pretty much the same sequence as far as I can tell. The second has all the tracking problems I mentioned - bass guitar for example, which was recorded by micing the amp in the low-budget version has some boom where it hits the resonant frequency of one of the nearby toms! Drums (although recorded with 2 mics only has one track as the mixer/PA had no pan function!) I would really appreciate it if you could listen to the raw form and then say how you would approach them (could repost the mixed versions if you have the time?) I would find this really educational, but I realise it is asking quite a lot, so I am happy either way. James _______________________________________________ Linux-audio-user mailing list Linux-audio-user@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx http://lists.linuxaudio.org/mailman/listinfo/linux-audio-user
