On Sep 7, 2012, at 7:36 PM, Barry Leiba <barryleiba@xxxxxxxxxxxx> wrote: > >> This raises the question of what "expires" means. > > > > At the least, if IDs are published publicly forever, then "expires" is no > > longer meaningful and the entirety of that notion needs to be expunged > > from the ID process. > > But you haven't addressed SM's comment. The point is that you and I have different views of what it means for a draft to expire. > > You seem to think it means something like "expunged from the record, and no longer available for viewing." I seem to think it means what it wk ways has. The desire to change that is the basis of this thread. > I think it means "no longer current for the purposes of work and discussion." What can that mean if it remains available to the public? What purpose does such an automatic timeout have if it is left up? IMO, none. > And I think those are very different things. The fact that expired drafts used to not be available for public viewing on the IETF site does not, by itself, mean that that was or is the intent of expiration. That is exact what it meant. Or are you claiming that it was a coincidence that this entire time that derafts were removed in sync with that expiry? Joe