Re: Comments requested on recent appeal to the IESG

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Douglas Otis wrote:
ESPs optimize profits by reducing their support calls. To do this, they might reduce erroneous rejections by tweaking SPF to make guesses. As such, it is not safe to assume that because the ESP accepted a message from an authorized SMTP client, that:

  A) the SMTP client was actually authorized, and

B) that this authorization verifies an authorizing domain emitted the message.

The safety of an assumption about an authorizing domain originating a message depends upon the reputation of the SMTP client for its protection of the PRA and Mail From. Unfortunately, identifiers for the SMTP client have been omitted. It appears ESPs have agreed not hold SMTP clients accountable to reduce ESP support calls. Having some of their customer's domains affected by a security breach is preferred over all customer's domains being affected (even when it would be appropriate for all domains).

However, choosing an ESP should involve more thinking. There are several reasons why end users need to trust their ESPs. If your ESP were malicious, they could play any sort of trick, probably also spoiling your bank account. Thus, I think end users should trust their ESPs not less than they trust their banks.

As far as I understand it, users should configure the MUA giving the domain of their ESP and telling it to trust auth-res headers from that domain only. The ESP is obviously responsible to avoid that counterfeit auth-res records "signed" by the ESP's domain are already present in the original headers. (This isn't foolproof, though: users who transfer their mail via, say, gmail's pop3 client, may be tempted to trust their original domain's records, which might be written by malicious authors who send to gmail directly.)

[...]
While MUAs might prompt users to enter the domains they wish to trust, this entry would be rather perilous. The exclusive use of the MAIL FROM or the PRA is not the norm, so it would be foolhardy to assume otherwise. MUAs should obtain an IP address list of SMTP clients vetted by either an organization or a community.

I'm sorry I elided the rest of the discussion, but the last point you make IMHO summarizes much of the misunderstandings about reporting the SMTP client's IP address. Shouldn't users delegate to their ESPs the choice of an organization or community who maintains such vetted lists of SMTP clients?

In case they should, then the whole job of authenticating the SMTP client can be carried out by the MTA, and communicating the address is useless. Maintaining such vetted lists formally (if not semantically) resembles the work of DNSBLs, which is why I thought that an addition like
   Authentication-Results: example.com;
     dnsbl=pass zone=zen.spamhaus.org address=192.0.2.3
would have been equivalent to your proposal.

In case they should not, then MUA software needs to be revamped in order to accommodate that functionality. That IP address will have to be communicated to MUAs, obviously. However, it is still questionable that the auth-res header is the proper place for doing that. In addition, a new protocol (possibly over http?) has to be standardized in order to allow MUAs to deploy the vetting service that you mention.

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