> I thought XMPP came from outside (www.jabber.org)? I believe that's correct. Sieve is another interesting case. It was originally developed "at" the IETF but not "by" the IETF, in that there were various informal meetings where it was designed but the initial documents were all individual submissionss. It was only much later that a working group was put in place. Sieve is also interesting in that have been quite a few active participants, including document authors, who rarely if ever attend meetings (and I believe some never have). The authorship of the various specifcations is also quite diverse along several axes (e.g., geography, past IETF participation, corporate backing). All in all, it's been a fun group to be involved in. I'm not drawing any conclusions here, just pointing out potentially interesting diversity in how things have been done. Ned _______________________________________________ Ietf@xxxxxxxx https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/ietf