-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- Hash: SHA1 The problem is not to produce specifications, but to get them used. The "What makes a protocol successful" presentation, shows that the best protocols are the ones given to IETF for it to refine and complete. They have already a user pull when they reach IETF. There is a weak link between IETF and NOGs. IETF is full of "engineer politics" There is no feedback loop on the specifications, including oversight on what the IETF is doing. Who knows what the IETF is? What does it do? etc... The specialized press does not follow the IETF work to give hints on what is likely to get adopted or not. The IETF journal is a good step in this direction. The IETF fellowships brings new blood. More steps need to be taken. You may need an ISAG (Internet Strategic Advisory Group), made of non engineers with one IETF liaison, who would provide vision, direction, analysis as well as reach out to communities. It could be composed of one rep from each NOG, one rep from the ICANN community, one rep from the business community, one rep from the media/press community, one rep from the user community. Cheers Dave Crocker wrote: > > > Christian Huitema wrote: >>> However we do need to have a basis for believing that the work we >>> are doing will actually get used. >> >> We went through that many times. The best way we have found so far >> is to >> verify that the proposed working group has a sufficient >> constituency. This >> has the advantage of not requiring economic or business judgments >> from the >> IESG. > > > Right. > > We don't have a problem with regularly producing specifications that > do not > get used. > > So there's no need to look for improvement in this arena. > > d/ > > ps. There is a difference between "economic or business judgements" > and simply trying to assess whether there is a serious desire by an > Internet community to use the work. The difference is fundamental, > so it's best not to confuse them. > - -- - -=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=- Franck Martin franck@xxxxxxxxx "Toute connaissance est une réponse à une question" G. Bachelard -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: GnuPG v1.4.7 (GNU/Linux) Comment: Using GnuPG with Mandriva - http://enigmail.mozdev.org iD8DBQFHdJqKvnmeYIHZEyARAoG7AJ9wny+fsTb0qXyrfPMQkLLuFW8C9wCgl90u 6CtN64vBB/JtaVK2uWpbiBc= =De1m -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- _______________________________________________ Ietf@xxxxxxxx https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/ietf