On Jun 12, 2024, at 01:18, Toerless Eckert <tte@xxxxxxxxx> wrote: > > How common is it actually that "bad behavior" as discussed here > actually negatively impacted the resulting technical output of the > IETF ? A large number of people left ietf@xxxxxxxx. The list had to be split into ietf@ and admin@ to get some participation back. I personally still have not returned to the IETF list. We will never know how many people stopped their participation or never came here to begin with after reading the IETF archive list full of toxic writing. The whole culture problem at the IETF started out as “we are rude and libertarian but we create the internet so deal with it and leave if you don’t like our culture”. The community has been working in various ways to improve this. One of these methods is to curb abusive and unwanted behaviour. The people claiming technical merit trumps abusive behaviour are picking short term minor gains at the expense of stability and security of the entire long term IETF viability. The biggest problem of BCP38 is that every sane normal action to restrict abuse results in more toxic discussions that a certain amount of abuse should be tolerated in the name of anti-censorship, lack of hard headedness of the victims and supposed technical merit of the abusers. Paul -- last-call mailing list -- last-call@xxxxxxxx To unsubscribe send an email to last-call-leave@xxxxxxxx
