Ole, I take Jay's points, including the need for protracted and complicated negotiations. He didn't mention it but I assume that, for the next few meetings, our choices of hotels may be considerably constrained by commitments we made to defer scheduled/contracted meetings during the pandemic. I also appreciate the offer of having the Secretariat intervene if there is a problem but assume such interventions would be much more likely to be successful if there were one or two emergency (and late) cancellations than if there were a dozen or two. The latter might occur if there were a major outbreak in mid- or late October, especially if it caused some major companies or supporting organizations to clamp down on travel, taking the decisions away from individuals. It is probably too late for London at this point but, at least for future meetings, I wonder if it would be possible for the IETF to negotiate two rates, a standard IETF one and something equivalent to an IETF "semi-flex" one, and let people decide whether the marginal cost of the latter is worth it for the added flexibility? In a way, that would be a form of IETF-negotiated insurance. Another possibility, which I assume the LLC has checked out and rejected is that, independent of Jay's comments about national insurance markets, it should be possible for the IETF to obtain hotel cancellation insurance to cover the costs of any cancellations by individuals between the 22nd day prior to the meeting and, say, November 6. By coincidence, London has been famous (since late in the 17th century if I recall) for organizations in the special risk insurance underwriting business and it would almost certainly be possible to obtain such a policy... even though, under today's circumstances, the cost might be completely unacceptable. FWIW, because other pandemic-related issues make it much harder to check out alternate places to say (especially semi-residential "rent a room" arrangements) wrt whatever COVID precautions one thinks are appropriate and because, as Eliot sort of pointed out, inexpensive rooms in good London hotels are now a rarity, a 21 day cancellation policy may be a bigger threat to "who actually attends in person" than any back-and-forth about IETF COVID policies, sharing a problem with the latter that an ideal policy (other than "just participate remotely") requires more ability to accurately predict the future than most of us have. best, john --On Tuesday, August 23, 2022 06:36 -0700 Ole Jacobsen <olejacobsen@xxxxxx> wrote: > Of course, this cancellation policy only applies to the group > rate. A "semi-flex" booking has a far more reasonable > condition, but this isn't the IETF rate: > > > > Ole > > >> On Aug 23, 2022, at 03:12, Jay Daley <exec-director@xxxxxxxx> >> wrote: >> >> Unfortunately these are more stringent cancellation terms >> than typical IETF contracts because things have changed >> considerably since the pandemic. Hotels have suffered and >> are trying to ensure that their risk is minimised and >> relationships are maintained with clients. By moving out >> the cancellation dates and increasing penalties, the risk is >> moved away from the hotel and the client to the guest. This >> is not our choice, but that of the hotel and these are the >> best terms to which we could get the hotel to agree. >> >> If you have to cancel because of COVID or another emergency >> then please speak to the hotel and also let the Secretariat >> know so that they can try to intervene. >> >> On a general note, please be aware that every hotel/venue >> negotiation we are involved in currently is noticeably more >> protracted and complicated than pre-pandemic. We expect this >> difficulty to continue for at least another year, with the >> effects felt some years out as we are currently booking for >> 2024 and 2025. >> >> Jay
