On Thu, 2004-11-11 at 17:40 -0700, Kim Lux wrote: > This is my last post on this subject. It appears as though some of us > disagree. I'll leave it at that. Comments below. Well, there is a problem with just leaving it at disagreeing. Eventually you are going to piss off some developer and he will tell you to take a hike. It has happened, and I won't cite the case to avoid embarrassing the offender, but it was case of much too high expectations. You're on that path as well. I suggest you *change* your expectation that upgrading from test releases must work (and if you think it should be fixed when broken, that too), or stop testing altogether. Otherwise, you are setting yourself up to be blasted by those who toil to give you the fruits of their labor for nothing other than some cooperation in troubleshooting a problem ... clean installs and upgrades from OFFICIAL releases being two of those steps. I agree with what someone else posted that you are a great help to many on this list, but I suspect that if something doesn't change with your expectations by the next testing cycle, you are going to find your reports of problems taken even less seriously than you say they are now. -- -Paul Iadonisi Senior System Administrator Red Hat Certified Engineer / Local Linux Lobbyist Ever see a penguin fly? -- Try Linux. GPL all the way: Sell services, don't lease secrets