Michael J. Knox wrote:
Rahul wrote:
Basically "The conclusion was that the interests of Fedora users
using proprietary NVidia modules outweigh the interests of other
users who would benefit from this update."[1]
Amazingly bad conclusion. So much for a detailed explanation of the
process. We might as well as have not discussed this issue and
conveyed the ideas better. What instead happened was that at the time
we were discussing this issue, the Xorg maintainer happened to Ajax
and he had no intention on his own to provide a update and we decided
that we need to have a general update policy and until then the
updates would be a maintainer's decision.
It might be a bad conclusion in the eyes of a RedHat employee and
someone high in the "ranks" of the Fedora community... but read the
writing on the wall!
If everyone is calling it a cow, it moos like a cow.. its a good chance
it is a cow, even if you call it a dog. As a Fedora user and (still) a
Fedora contributor, it is the same conclusion I drew from the issue.
Just pointing out its a incorrect conclusion. Your perception doesnt
change that. If you want to continue spreading a wrong idea regardless
of the facts, that's your choice but it is not in the best interests of
the project.
I was also there when everyone was berating Eric S. Raymond for the
mere suggestion of RedHat making it easier for end users to add MP3
and DVD support. The sheer notation of doing so, left the
fedora-devel mailing looking like a kindergarden play yard (not too
mention IRC).Fedora's attitude towards those that do need 3rd party,
non-distributable or non-free, is doing it damage. I am just telling
you how it is out there, out side your little RedHat office....
First, lets stop with belittling other people. My Fedora work has
nothing to do with Red Hat. I have been involved with Fedora much
before I joined Red Hat so what office I am in is completely
irrelevant to the current discussion. I have spend enough time "out
there" too to understand the issues that pop up quite often.
Clearly you don't understand, either that, or you are covering your ears
and going "la la la la la everything is fine la la la la la" because the
landscape is not peachy for Fedora in my country.
Good attitude there. You assumed that I am sitting in a office and not
speaking to other people or events. That assumption is just not true.
ESR didnt merely come up with a polite request to add MP3 support. He
claimed incorrect things about the patents not covering decoders. The
mail was full of inflammatory leads.
Right or wrong approach to a subject does not make the subject its self
wrong.
Stating completely incorrect facts in a inflammatory mail does mean that
your valid points if any has very good chances of getting lost.
In my opinion, ESR has some very valid points, one that didn't
seem to be heard.
Please specify exactly what changes you wanted to be done. As I
understand it, his changes were clearly heard and rejected as being
contradictory to the Fedora objectives.
That is NOT what is being asked for or even suggested!! Ubuntu, for
example, does not redistribute non-free in its distribution, however, it
(non-free) is made easily accessable (legally) through hosted
repositories. My initial comment was that is should not be a "cardinal
sin" to advising users on how to install perfectly legal 3rd party
packages.
I didnt see anybody claim it was a cardinal sin. Ubuntu by the way does
distribute non-free software.
https://www.redhat.com/archives/fedora-advisory-board/2006-April/msg00170.html
http://www.ubuntu.com/ubuntu/licensing
Look up kernel-restricted package for example. Different distributions
have different objectives. Let's just accept that and not try to be
mimic what others do.
Yep. I have already set the stories straight many times and I will
continue to do so.
Seems to be working well, since Fedora's popularity appears to be
falling.....
Those two are not connected.
I see nothing from Fedora that indicates that its addressing valid and
real issues that hamper the ability for users to switch or even in some
cases, recommend, Fedora. The fact that Fedora seems to be loosing
favor, only proves to me, that what ever is being do, is not working.
Maybe I am wrong.. maybe everyone in the LUGs around have it right... I
don't know.
It would nice to have a list of those real world issues and what changes
is expected. Other than the suggestion that we include proprietary
software either in the distribution or as a repository, do you have any
other ideas?
Rahul
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