On Jun 9, 2008, Les Mikesell <lesmikesell@xxxxxxxxx> wrote: > Alexandre Oliva wrote: >> On Jun 9, 2008, Les Mikesell <lesmikesell@xxxxxxxxx> wrote: >> >>> Firmware that happens to be aggregated for convenient delivery and >>> installation is no more a part of the GPL'd work than firmware that is >>> already in your machine >> >> That's missing the point. > No, it _is_ the point. No, you're focusing only on the firmware. I'm focusing on the whole work distributed under the name Linux and allegedly (and falsely) under GPLv2, in spite of containing these firmwares so intertwined that you can't just rip off the "pages" of the book corresponding to the firmwares and expect the rest of make sense (to a compiler). Although a number of the firmwares are indeed printed in "separate pages" (files), some are actually interspersed with GPLed code. Even if you were to believe the theory that separate files bound together say at link are covered by the "mere aggregation in the same media" exception, I don't see how it could possibly fly when it's hard even to pinpoint the separate works within a single file, and that modifying that file so as to remove the offending portions might even be argued as a violation of the license of the offending portions. This all *screams* SINGLE WORK, not separate works. To be separate works, you'd have to start out by being able to point at and obtain both/all the works separately. > The GPL'd part doesn't depend any more or less on it whether it is > loaded on the fly or already there in ROM Please tell me you don't honestly believe you wouldn't have to modify the GPLed part to be able to load the tg3 firmwares on the fly or use them straight from ROM. > You do have access to all of the parts and the freedom to split them > up any way you want. What's stopping you? Nothing. In fact, I'm doing just that. However, this doesn't mean I didn't have to modify any of the allegedly separate works in order to accomplish that. I did. So how are they separate works in the first place? If you have to rephrase a chapter of a book for it to make sense if you print the book after removing another chapter, could you honestly defend the claim that the chapters were separate works in the first place? > Exactly. If such aggregations weren't permitted and perfectly normal > when you meet the terms of each component separately, we probably > wouldn't have had any anthologies to read for homework in school. Read again what you wrote. "when you meet the terms of each component separately". Think about it. That some authors don't object to anthologies derived from their works doesn't make all anthologies permissible by copyright law. You still have to get permission from the copyright holders of each individual work and comply with their terms. Think about it this way: If you want to publish a sequel of a novel along with its predecessor, and the license you have doesn't grant you permission to modify the work, then no matter how odd it looks to have the end of the predecessor repeated (with changes) in the first chapter of the sequel, that's how you gotta publish them. Now, consider this: you got a copy this fictitious kernel with source code and firmware embedded in it, but you don't have permission to modify the kernel at all, even though you have source code and permission to study it, recompile it and distribute it. So you look at the sources and you notice that you don't want this firmware in your kernel image, because you don't have the device that requires it. So you remove the firwmare and notice that the kernel won't compile any more. What now? Do you get permission to modify the kernel (creating a derived work thereof) just because it won't compile after you rip off a "separate work"? Is it really still a separate work if you have to do that? -- Alexandre Oliva http://www.lsd.ic.unicamp.br/~oliva/ Free Software Evangelist oliva@{lsd.ic.unicamp.br, gnu.org} FSFLA Board Member ¡Sé Libre! => http://www.fsfla.org/ Red Hat Compiler Engineer aoliva@{redhat.com, gcc.gnu.org} -- fedora-devel-list mailing list fedora-devel-list@xxxxxxxxxx https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/fedora-devel-list
