On Tue, Nov 5, 2024 at 6:41 AM Liam Proven <liam.proven@xxxxxxxxxx> wrote: > > On Tue, 5 Nov 2024 at 08:51, Daniel P. Berrangé <berrange@xxxxxxxxxx> wrote: > > > > Beefy Miracle was the beginning of the end of release names for Fedora. > > In one single event it epitomized everything that was bad about the > > Fedora release names concept & the process. > > Agreed. > > This is one of the things Debian and Ubuntu get right: they have > themes, and associable, memorable, neutral meanings for the codenames. > > Debian is simple: they are Toy Story characters. The end. > > Ubuntu is a bit more subtle: an adjective, which is the general usage, > and an animal, which will usually be neutral for most people. They are > careful to choose positive adjectives, which may be slangy or > colloquial or obscure, but are not negative. > You missed the third attribute: All Ubuntu codenames are alliterative. That helps make them memorable and stand out. The brain likes patterns, and feeding it with patterned names makes it far easier to stand out and remember. > Some Fedora codenames were 1 word, some 2. Most were weird and > conveyed a strong feeling of in-jokes. Some were possibly American and > did not translate. > > Naming a release after a hard to trace bug? Not good. Tells me to > avoid that release. > > "Beefy Miracle"? WTF? Later I learned this may be after an ad slogan. > Newsflash, few ads get shown in multiple countries without > translation. "Beefy" is complex and may not be positive for a billion > Hindus. Miracle adds to the dubious religious overtones. > > The combination says to me "this is an in joke we thought was funny > and we don't care if you don't understand or if it upsets people," > which by extension means "we like it and we don't care if you don't". > > Many of the older ones were overly Americo-centric, or references > which were not obvious, like comic books or scientists, which again > has an undertone of "we are so clever and we like our little club and > you're not in it". > And Toy Story characters aren't? That's a little unfair. If you didn't know Debian lore, you weren't going to know Debian codenames are Toy Story characters. The point of codenames is to provide a little nugget of something to make it memorable to the people who worked on it and to the people who talk about it. Nothing more, nothing less. Whether it's "Amerocentric" or geeky or whatever is beside the point. If it's not outright insanity, it's probably fine. One of the things I've noticed is that people keep trying to drain the things that give a project personality out of them. Functional names aren't memorable. Simple numbers tell nothing about the project. Being quirky is okay. :) > Secondly, Debian/Ubuntu codenames are used in config files. They have > a meaning and significance. Fedora ones, AFAIK, didn't. > The fact that Debian uses them in config files is a historical accident that people keep trying to fix. There was even an article about it on LWN a few years back: https://lwn.net/Articles/792646/ To be honest, I'm not sure why Ubuntu does this when they try very hard to avoid using the codename in professional marketing material. -- 真実はいつも一つ！/ Always, there's only one truth! -- _______________________________________________ devel mailing list -- devel@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx To unsubscribe send an email to devel-leave@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx Fedora Code of Conduct: https://docs.fedoraproject.org/en-US/project/code-of-conduct/ List Guidelines: https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Mailing_list_guidelines List Archives: https://lists.fedoraproject.org/archives/list/devel@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx Do not reply to spam, report it: https://pagure.io/fedora-infrastructure/new_issue
