On Mon, Apr 06, 2020 at 04:02:34PM +0100, Leigh Griffin wrote: > Ok let's scenario this out so as several people want us to restart […] In this context of "restarting the scenario": > How do we accommodate that when our other stakeholders' needs are now > not being met as a whole and when the original requirements needs are > being satisfied by the choice of Gitlab (which will most likely be CE > for Fedora). This is to be taken with a grain of salt. There are quite a few people in this thread mentioning that it conflicts with the Fedora mission statement - which I'd see as being part of the original requirements implicitely. This might be less problematic with GitLab CE, which I assume seems to be the current plan. > What happens then, how do you suggest we proceed at that point? The > other stakeholder groups are already progressing with Gitlab and we > can do that for them and pause the Fedora move in this direction if > that was the scenario. What happens after months of debate if we > cannot bridge that divide? That is very easy. If it is not *possible* to have a common solution, it is necessary to have separate solutions. Everything else would be forcing a stakeholder to a solution not meeting their requirements. And yes, if one stakeholder (eg. Fedora) just insists on Pagure, and another stakeholder (maybe that internal RedHat group?) just insists on GitLab, you can either force the decision, or have both. > What happens when Pagure is sunset as the CPE team cannot run it / > maintain it? I'm genuinely curious here as if this is a path the > community want to go down then engage with Council on it but I think it > could be harmful for the project as a whole. If Fedora continues to use Pagure, and the RedHat internal group uses GitLab, and CPE sunsets Pagure, this means, another team needs to take over. (Which is not a GDPR problem as long as there is no data in there which is not allowed to be there anyway. Even then access can be provided, if necessary) After that the CPE does not have fedora-dist-management on their plate anymore and can focus on different things. Budget: Depending on what percentage of CPE teams duties are seen as fedora-specific-dist-management that might also mean some reduction in size of the CPE team in favor of the new fedora-dist-management-team. (Can also be seen as some people switching from CPE to the new team) Later it might be possible for migrating the RedHat internal group on Pagure, or Fedora on GitLab, but that needs to come from inside the community/team, and not be forced on a community/team. > That's not my choice though and until otherwise told, we are > progressing in this direction. With this you're actively choosing to continue acting following *your* decision. As mentioned in another post, it might be best to pause the whole thing for some time, an then try another path on how to proceed forward. (There is no reset, what has been done can't be just "reversed") And yes, this means not pushing for a solution in the "pause time", and yes, this also means no dicussions with GitLab, and no trying to make Pagure more GitLab like, no waiting until the dust settles to just continue with the GitLab path, and no forcing the "pause time" to be so long, that Pagure is chosen due to process stalling. That means first focussing on how to resolve the situation, before taking another step. It's obvious that there is a big problem right now, and it needs to be addressed first. If it is important to you that some formal body pauses the process and not yourself, please either name that entity or preferably request a statement about pausing or continuing the planned process yourself. From other emails it seems this formal body is the Council, but I'd like to have a confirmation for that assumption. All the best, David
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