----- Original Message ----- > From: "Ralf Corsepius" <rc040203@xxxxxxxxxx> > To: devel@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx > Sent: Wednesday, November 6, 2019 3:32:03 AM > Subject: Re: Modularity: The Official Complaint Thread > > On 11/5/19 9:41 PM, Alex Scheel wrote: > > > IMO, without a resolution in Fedora we'll never get one in RHEL. > > And? Why should Fedora care about RHEL? Why? Because Modularity was foisted the wrong direction. In an ideal world, Modularity would've been proposed to Fedora, it would've been discussed by the community, improved, perfected, and _then_ brought into the RHEL fold only when stable! Fedora would've _driven_ the innovation, rather than having to keep up with whatever RHEL decided to do, being careful not to break anything. We don't live in an ideal world and deadlines, initial rejection by Fedora, and issues implementing Modularity forced at least _some_ of it to go the other direction, RHEL -> Fedora. So now we're stuck trying to improve Modularity in Fedora, without stepping on any RHEL toes, and knowing full well that if the community rejects Modularity in Fedora (again!), we're stuck supporting it in RHEL through RHEL 8 (and, likely into RHEL 9). And I think that worries some people, hence the attempt to influence discussions, name calling, &c. Others however, want Fedora to remain fully independent of RHEL, and thus have asked that _failure_ be an option explicitly on the table. I don't work on Modularity though. I only have to use it. I'm, at best, agnostic as to whether or not it survives in Fedora. But, I do have to use it in RHEL. There, I'd far rather see it improve (and, have a chance to influence improvements to issues I've directly hit NOW rather than later). I'd hate to see it stagnate in its current state. > I for one consider RHEL not to be its partner, but it to be an > initiative to gradually push Fedora out of this planet. I think that's going a little far. They cater to two different audiences: hackers or business people. The former will put up with cutting-edge software and whatever documentation is freely available. The latter will pay big money for support and consulting to make sure nothing breaks, and to fix it if it does. I'd argue that if RHEL wanted to push anyone out, Fedora would be a stupid target. RHEL doesn't really compete with Fedora. Target CentOS first! Its RHEL, but free! But we don't. Red Hat stepped _up_ its participation in CentOS. We pay people to work on CentOS full-time, so it keeps going. I think that's the _opposite_ of trying to push CentOS out of this planet. Same goes for Fedora. And with RHEL 9, we've announced that we view Fedora as the _upstream_ for RHEL. More collaboration, not less! https://fedoramagazine.org/fedora-and-centos-stream/ I'd ask you to consider that we aren't Microsoft of the '90s... We are human and make mistakes from time to time, but we aren't evil. We're an Open Source company, and try our best to embody that. We try our best to work _with_ the community, not against it. That's why all of these modularity discussions _have_ been in the open and happening right here, in Fedora. Not on some private mailing list inside Red Hat. At any rate, Pierre's points are also valid. - Alex > > Ralf > _______________________________________________ > devel mailing list -- devel@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx > To unsubscribe send an email to devel-leave@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx > Fedora Code of Conduct: > https://docs.fedoraproject.org/en-US/project/code-of-conduct/ > List Guidelines: https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Mailing_list_guidelines > List Archives: > https://lists.fedoraproject.org/archives/list/devel@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx > _______________________________________________ devel mailing list -- devel@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx To unsubscribe send an email to devel-leave@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx Fedora Code of Conduct: https://docs.fedoraproject.org/en-US/project/code-of-conduct/ List Guidelines: https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Mailing_list_guidelines List Archives: https://lists.fedoraproject.org/archives/list/devel@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
