> On 11/06/2010 01:53 AM, Ralf Corsepius wrote: > > On 11/05/2010 09:46 PM, Michael Schwendt wrote: > >> On Fri, 05 Nov 2010 17:56:51 +0100, Ralf wrote: > >>> ABRT > >>> It doesn't tell the user that core dumps without reproducer are > >>> worthless in most cases but blindly sends out reports > >> > >> Parts of the Fedora user base "abuse" ABRT in that they refuse to > >> fill in the empty fields. Blame the reporters not the tool. > > > > A matter of point of view: To me this is an ABRT GUI issue. It currently > > doesn't suck as much as it did before, nevertheless its usability still > > leaves much to be desired. > > Agreed > > It has been improving but is far from novice usage perfection but > whether that is good or bad all boils down to the so called "Target user > base"<sigh>. > > > As yourself: > > What would you do if you were a "simple computer user" and are facing > > this "flash bulb icon" asking you to become "root" and to get a bugzilla > > account? > > > > You'd call your sys-admin, who'll deinstall or deactivate ABRT pretty > > > > soon, when you call him for the "Nth time". > > > > As a user you'd also think "what kind of crap is this Fedora/Linux - > > > > the WinXP I have at home is better". > > The same problem here applies to all regardless of OS or Application. > > If the entry level is to high or OS or Application give novice end user > to much "in you face time" they replace it or find a way to silence the > nuance one way or another. > > >> It's too > >> easy for such people to open tickets via ABRT and then ignore > >> a maintainer's NEEDINFO request. > > > > Correct - But the same applies to maintainers. > > > > My experience is, most of them ignore ABRT reports, probably because > > the ABRT reports are not helpful to them and/or don't contain sufficient > > infos. > > Same applies to human directly submitted report.... > > >> It's disheartening in some cases, but > >> it's a people-problem not a tool-problem. > > > > I disagree - IMO; ABRT is not end-user ready. It presumes end-users > > to be familiar with redhat's infrastructure, which is a developer > > infrastructure and them to be interested to get involved into Fedora > > development. This simply does not apply. > > Again it all boils down to the so called "Target user base".... I wonder is there a single OS that targets a single user base??? And if we define a target user base - we will ditch everything else ? And are contributors that care for different target user base gonna be hound to stop contributing because Fedora Project doesn't care for their contributions? Such ideas are way more terrible than a few bugreports didn't get responded. P.S I'm really missing how defining a target user base won't hurt the project as a whole. Alex > > JBG -- devel mailing list devel@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx https://admin.fedoraproject.org/mailman/listinfo/devel
