On Mon, Apr 23, 2018 at 6:49 AM, Sage Weil <sage@xxxxxxxxxxxx> wrote: > [Moving to ceph-devel] > > On Mon, 23 Apr 2018, Kai Wagner wrote: >> Hi all, >> >> I would like to start the "tool's" discussion once again. I attended the >> Ceph Day in London last week and after a few beers after the event we >> started to talk about how Ceph upstream does issue and feature tracking. >> I had those conversation already several times at different events but >> every time the outcome was the same - "Should be improved!". >> >> The problem here is, that Trello is not made for what we're currently >> trying to use it for. On the other hand lots of those cards only have a >> single "headline" without any former context. This makes it really hard >> to follow and contribute. Also the linking between the tracker and >> trello is manual work. >> >> I would like to start a discussion about Jira again. It's possible to >> request an Open Source license which makes it possible to use Jira >> completely unlimited including all the Plugins. The >> "dashboard/openATTIC" team did that for many years already - >> tracker.openattic.org >> >> Within Jira bugs, features, improvements and as well as releases could >> be easily tracked. We would reduce the tool suite from two total >> different tools to just one tool which could be used for everything. I >> would volunteer here to help with any questions regarding Jira or the >> request process. > > (Note that there is a third tool here--github--that probably isn't going > away.) > > I'm game for a better tool. The main friction with change here is around > the bug tracking in redmine, just because there are so many issues there > covering such a large time period, but if we're talking about > feature/radomap/release tracking (which are already handled outside of > redmine) then I don't see that as a problem. > > I'm personally not super thrilled about jira because it's a closed > platform, even if they do offer free accounts for open source projects. > (Yes, github and trello are no better.) > > Right now the only trello board I really use is > > https://trello.com/b/ugTc2QFH/ceph-backlog > > and I only use it for a high-level view of feature work across the > project. The lists are per-topic or subsystem, which isn't (I think?) how > these things are normally shown (i.e., it's not kanban). The only other > thing it does it loosely track what is targetted at the next release via > colored labels. That's all pretty basic, and to be honest I don't know > that I need much more. Who else actually uses the Trello board, for what? My impression is that it was basically only useful as described here: essentially a checklist of features in vague states so somebody like Sage can see what pieces need to be poked at. When I was a tech lead I actually liked Redmine for feature tracking much more than my limited interactions with Trello — it just doesn't allow enough relationships between cards compared to the "Blocked by" and other options, the sub-tasks, component and category settings, etc. If we went to Jira (which has been discussed before) I assume it would be quite silly to migrate feature tracking but not bugs. IIRC the main reason any features moved out of Redmine was because Sage wanted that Trello overview, and I'm not quite sure if other components used fewer facets of Redmine than me, or if they've found Trello to better fit existing workflows, if the explicit tracking just turned out to be not that useful given our web of development, or if leads are filling in with other tools. Personally I'd rather just switch back to Redmine for features as well — there are plenty of plugins and my understanding is many of them are better than when we last used them. -Greg > > On the other hand, it's not very useful for other contributors (especially > new ones) to come look at. That's partly because there is no detail > written for the cards, but that could easily be fixed by writing up some > notes for each item, linking to the relevant CDM discussions or etherpad > notes, and so on. > > So I guess my question are we looking for out of the tool(s), and what > is currently missing? > > sage > -- > To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe ceph-devel" in > the body of a message to majordomo@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx > More majordomo info at http://vger.kernel.org/majordomo-info.html -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe ceph-devel" in the body of a message to majordomo@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx More majordomo info at http://vger.kernel.org/majordomo-info.html
