Yes, and I'll submit they existed in high cost of living metropolitan areas in that ear and earlier for the same reasons, especially so prior to the run up in airline industry wages during the 1980s-1990s. The "good old times" are back again, though. - Bob Allan9 wrote: > Crash pads existed in the 1960s. Can't blame todays economic salary > conditions. > Al > > ----- Original Message ----- From: "RWM" <RWM@xxxxxxxxxx> > To: <AIRLINE@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx> > Sent: Friday, February 17, 2006 2:23 PM > Subject: Re: Next Few Days Critical for Northwest > > >> Couldn't afford Danish at those levels of income! And the food >> stamps for which those incomes qualify don't cover Danish anyway. >> >> States prescribe different levels, reflecting regional/local cost of >> living. Try being a NYC-based reserve FA or pilot at those wages, >> explaining why 'crash pads' exist. >> >> Mike Bloomberg reluctantly agrees that $32,000 - NYPD salary after 6 >> months - is barely making it (but blames it on NYPD salary negotiators). >> >> >> >> David MR wrote: >> >>> Checking the web, I found the following: >>> Federal proverty level for 2005: >>> Family Size/Annual wages >>> 1/$9,570 >>> 2/$12,830 >>> 3/$16,090 >>> 4/$19,350 >>> >>> Median starting flight attendant pay $15,552 >>> (http://www.bls.gov/oco/ocos171.htm) >>> Average starting pilot pay: $14,137. >>> (http://www.avjobs.com/table/airsalry.asp) >>> Though both are low, neither of these are below the proverty level >>> for a family of 1 or 2. >>> David R >>> Buy Danish >>> >>> -------------- Original message -------------- From: Allan9 >>> <exatc@xxxxxxxxxx> >>> >>>> Alireza >>>> Maybe we need to clarify what you describe as near the poverty >>>> level. What do you feel describes that level for pliots and F/As. >>>> What do you feel is "fair"?" >>>> Now I realize you have a horse in the race but to be fair in >>>> discussing the reasonableness of the offer I for one would like to >>>> know? >>>> My horse put out to stud back in 1994. So I've been gone for >>>> awhile. Been a long time since mutual aid days Al >>>> >>>> ----- Original Message ----- From: "Alireza Alivandivafa" To: Sent: >>>> Friday, February 17, 2006 12:09 PM Subject: Re: Next Few Days >>>> Critical for Northwest >>>> >>>> >>>>> Rickenbacker. You missed Howard Hughes in that one. I disagree >>>>> that union offers at this point are to be considered unreasonable. >>>>> F/A's now live down near the poverty line. The legacies have kept >>>>> on outsourcing express flying to airlines that pay pilots below >>>>> the poverty line, even when any simple economic analysis can show >>>>> that they are losing money on non-turbo prop express flying and >>>>> would be better off paying more in wages to fly it themselves. >>>>> These aren't the days of "Delta + 1 or United + 1". >>>>> >>>>> In a message dated 2/17/2006 11:00:50 AM Central Standard Time, >>>>> damiross3@xxxxxxxxxxx writes: Both are to be blamed. Unions >>>>> because of their unreasonable offers Management because they are >>>>> bean counters and view Northwest as just another business. They >>>>> are not like the great airline CEO's of the past such as Six, >>>>> Frye, Trippe, Rickenbecker (sp?), etc. >>>>