2009/10/22 Máirín Duffy <duffy@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>: > On 10/22/2009 09:37 AM, Mike McGrath wrote: >> I'm just going to bring up the elephant in the room, at least the one I >> see. Up until this discussion I was under the impression that Ubuntu and >> us were not in direct competition. They were catering to noobs and >> general users, we were catering to enthusiasts and experienced users. >> Coming out of this conversation (not just with Paul but with everyone) it >> seems clear that Ubuntu's goals and our goals greatly overlap if not >> completely overlap. I think characterizing Ubuntu as catering to noobs is a gross simplification of their philosophy and mission. They advertise a server distribution on their front page unlike Fedora and I doubt its target audience is a bunch of noobs. They have a large and broad community and a very clear statement of their philosophy that in some important ways I think is stronger and more clear about certain things I care very much about. http://www.ubuntu.com/community/ubuntustory/philosophy In practice, I think Fedora's actions speak louder than its words. > I don't think our goals do overlap though. To us, following an > excellent, open process of producing software is just as important as > producing excellent, open source software. One of our goals is to be a > model and an example of that process, and to prove it works so it may be > taken up by other domains. > > I don't think they care about that at all. > > To us, the means are not justified by the ends - they are just as > important. I think to Ubuntu, the ends justify the means. In the far back corners of my brain this rings a bell reminding me of the arguments I listened to between the free software and open source camps when the idea of rebranding free software first began to surface. >> The problem? They are KILLING us. I'm not talking about market share, >> I'm talking about my recent converts from Fedora to Ubuntu. I haven't had >> to do a single thing to my wifes computer since I put Ubuntu on there >> except setup my printer. With Fedora I was on it almost daily. > > Did yum updates cause the breakage? Perhaps it is the level of strictness about what software is allowed into the distribution ... our refusal to include a "restricted component" repository which makes the life of a user who doesn't care easier? One thing about the Fedora vs. Ubuntu comparison that I always find striking when I think about it is that the Fedora community's actions align closely to free software but the community doesn't seem very fond of calling it that, while the Ubuntu community actions align more closely (at least in my mind) with the open source movement (in terms of putting a higher initial premium on use, "we'll get to the philosophy part later") but its community prefers the association with free software. In the far back corners of my brain I recall people reminding others that both the free software and open source camps were part of the same community and I think it is important to keep in mind that Fedora and Ubuntu are as well. John _______________________________________________ fedora-advisory-board mailing list fedora-advisory-board@xxxxxxxxxx http://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/fedora-advisory-board
