On Fri, 23 Mar 2007, Michael Bourgeous wrote: > Ingo's solution gets my vote. I AM a programmer, and I have written > kernel code, hotplug scripts, etc. Nobody is taking those away. The > default is simply being made more sensible. Writing a new script for > every sound card, or figuring out a nice regex to write one script for > multiple cards, is something I really don't want to mess with just to > listen to some music or when I'm writing my own music. Nobody says > the default cannot be changed. It is very easy for GNOME, KDE, XFCE, > etc. to provide a configuration application with a checkbox saying > "Make new sound cards the default" - I believe that KDE is already > working on something close to this. Fine, and they will almost certainly do it via a hotplug script, or on kde bootup. It may even be a HAL daemon kind of thing. > > The other solution of allowing a fallback default device is VERY > sensible. Sometimes I don't have my Tascam US-428 plugged in, maybe > because I'm using it with my laptop or I just didn't want to turn it > on. Or, if my default device is set to a jackd PCM device, and jackd > isn't running, I want to fall back to plughw. ?? So you now want alsa to read your mind if the default is not there? It would be possible but as I said, prone to bugs and errors. > > I disagree that all sound applications should be able to select the > device independently. Yes, it's a nice feature, and not difficult to > implement, but ALSA provides the "default" PCM construct, so that > users can choose to change just one setting (possibly through a GUI) > instead of having to specify "-D plughw:1" on several different > command line settings scattered through various places. One may also That is irrelevant. To have a program ONLY support the "default" soundcard sound to me to be a very bad idea. And to have that default be able to change under the program's feet would just compound the problem. > argue that ignoring the common user is discrimination based on > intelligence or past experience, which sounds a little like the > definition of fascism that was quoted previously. You state at the end that you want to get away from calling people names and yet here you dive in with both feet. Which is it? Or is it only you that wants to be able to do it? > > My final point is that saying that ALSA shouldn't be similar to > something that might possibly be done right in Vista because it is > written by Nazi-like individuals is very closed minded. Microsoft ??? Nothing like this was written anywhere before. The OP argued that Vista did it, and thus alsa should as well. I argued that it should not, and that if under LInux you wanted it to behave differently there was already a mechanism ( hotplug) to allow you to do that. And I argued that a similar mechanism to change the default behaviour under vista did not exist. It was that insistance on only one way of doing things in vista that I called fascist. > certainly doesn't have a monopoly on good ideas, but neither does > anybody else. ALSA could benefit greatly from providing better You are so busy building your staw men that the argument has fled. > defaults for users and distribution makers, and tools for changing > those defaults (even if those tools are just templates for hotplug It could also benefit from better documentation and support of many more soundcards without trouble. Now is this you offering to help in one or more of these efforts? (Note that I am not an alsa developer, and will not be doing any of those things. I have contributed in a very small way in other areas of Linux). > scripts). I don't like Windows, but it is possible to change a lot of > default behavior by changing registry entries (not unlike modifying > files in /etc) - I don't think Linux or ALSA is well-served by making > exaggerated statements about the ineptitude of Vista. I doubt the OP ??? Where are these statements about the ineptitude of Vista? > wanted an ideological debate. Let's please stick to facts, focusing It was the OP that introduced discussion of Vista into the argument. To paraphrase "Vista does it this way, thus alsa should do it the same way". > on improving ALSA (even if the ideas weren't our own) instead of > calling names. Of course. I hope that you lead by example. ------------------------------------------------------------------------- Take Surveys. Earn Cash. Influence the Future of IT Join SourceForge.net's Techsay panel and you'll get the chance to share your opinions on IT & business topics through brief surveys-and earn cash http://www.techsay.com/default.php?page=join.php&p=sourceforge&CID=DEVDEV _______________________________________________ Alsa-user mailing list Alsa-user@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/alsa-user
