Trevor -
The image is not created for the web. It has another use and it has nothing to do with anything flat. I think the shadow is crap too, and I have nothing to do with its manufacture. I sell shadows, but not in this case. I’m selling the covering for a car and the shadow is to appease viewers who might complain if it were served up floating in space.
Believe it or not, there are people on this list whom I know personally and we have conversations.
If there is any one thing I can say about myself, it is that I do not suffer fools gladly. I’m aware of this, but if yo uwere to speak to me say on Skype, I’m not like what I write here.
JAn
On Mar 18, 2013, at 11:56 AM, Trevor Cunningham wrote: Jan September will mark a decade for me as a member of this forum. At the time I joined, I had begun to pursue a master's degree in educational technology. One assignment was to join listserves in an effort to grow a professional network. I was also working at a school in Cairo that had asked me to start a photography program as I had been curious about their darkroom for the chance I might learn more about the analog world of monochrome. Having to teach myself processing and printing before I could take on high school students, I found this forum and learned from people who were supportive, experienced, inspired, and as excited as I was (and still am) about photography. Many of the more spirited threads in my early days made expressed considerable relief from your absence and routinely deepened into rich discussions. While your impressive resume suggests that you have likely forgotten more about photography than many people on this list will ever know, my impression of you is that of a photograph. Something to be admired; enigmatic for interpretation; to be consumed. If we walk away from you uninspired, the gate will be bovine. I find it tragic that someone with your talent, valuable experience, and, likely, insight, participating in a forum dedicated to learning, proves to be such a vacuous source of regressive self-aggrandizement. However, that you make such damned fine pictures causes me to wish someone could actually have a conversation with you. I'll begin by expanding on my digested comment about the shadow under the car being "crap", and I genuinely do feel this way. If this image is intended for the web, then the shadow works perfectly as it looks like just about every other PSD template to be sliced up for CSS and HTML. As such, it makes me think of the sound of over-produced late '70s rock and roll. Compressed, inorganic, and fake. The shadow looks sculpted, like an afterthought. Merely an observation. On 3/18/13 5:22 PM, Jan Faul wrote:
I also left Photoforum for about 10 years. Why? Because of people who don’t know their ass from a hole in the ground about anything. Theoretically we are all here to learn but some here are misinformed about not just photography but life too.
Yes, Yoram is entitled to his opinion, but he is not making smart choices in making inane comments after only being a photographer for about 2+ years. You don’t learn from people you anger because they are unwilling to teach you.
I am not who I was ten years ago and I don’t think anybody else here is either. To quote JD Souther, “Times passes, things change."
Jan
On Mar 18, 2013, at 12:03 AM, Randy Little wrote:
Andrew having starting photographing when I was to young to remember getting a 620 camera and getting my first SLR at age 9. I will quote Picasso. Good artist borrow great artist steal. With the exposure to other works and their knowledge you will stagnate with the limited education you can get by just shooting. I worked for Arnold Newman joyce tenneson, Ryzard Horowitz, Michelle Tcherevkoff, and a boat load of other photographers. with that knowledge I learned Much more then I could have ever learned by just shootings. By that note I learned more/different things from them then I learned at RIT. Although having gone to RIT is was got me those gigs back in the day. Now I have been working in Feature Films for the past decade after my studio in NYC was closed by 9/11. Now I am shooting a new book my work is being hung already in a very prestigious show and I have returned to Photo Forum after many years away. Jan is still Jan and I still take what wisdom he has and I take ALL comments. I also know when comments are ill informed. I can deal with that. Cause I deal with clients all day every day since I started working in Photography studios in 1989 while still in High School. Only the Journey matters sounds like something Minor white would say has he cut out the 1 in square of a students work and comment "I like this part."
Randy S. Little
http://www.rslittle.com <http://reel.rslittle.com/>
http://www.imdb.com/name/nm2325729/
On Sun, Mar 17, 2013 at 8:31 PM, <asharpe@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx <mailto:asharpe@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>> wrote:
Jan,
I agree with some of this, and disagreee with some of this. Yoram's
opinion, is, well, his opinion, and you cannot take that away
from him.
And believe it or not, many viewers of our work will only make
simplistic
(but sometimes insightful) remarks on our work.
We do not make our work solely for photographers; indeed, we
shouldn't
make it for others, either, unless we are doing commerial work.
Rather, we
do the work for ourselves. Since we put so much of ourselves into our
work, of course it hurts a bit to have short, direct -- seemingly
shallow,
but not necessarily -- criticism of it. But that is reality.
Having worked with so many names in photography (there was a bit
too much
name-dropping in your email, but I do understand -- and respect
-- that
you have worked with many photographers, and have many years of
experience), you obviously have seen much of their work treated
the same
way as Yoram did. It doesn't lessen the photographers, nor does
it lessen
you. In fact, this RIT forum is specifically *not* to show your
best work,
or to "educate", as you put it. Andy's statement for this forum
states
that it is a friendly place to put out perhaps experimental work,
in hopes
of getting feedback. Well, you did.
With respect to your advice that Yoram goes to a photography
workshop,
I'll leave you with a quote from the photographer Harry Callahan
(I didn't
see him in your list, but perhaps you worked with him as well),
who says
(emphasis is Mr. Callahan's, based on a copy of this I've seen,
written in
his own hand):
"To be a photographer, one must PHOTOGRAPH. No amount of book
learning, no
checklist of seminars attended, can substitute for the SIMPLE ACT OF
MAKING PICTURES. Experience is the best teacher of all. And for that,
there is no guarantee that one will become an artist. ONLY THE
JOURNEY
MATTERS."
Andrew
On Sun, March 17, 2013 10:18 am, Jan Faul wrote:
>
> Yoram’s dissection of this week’s photographs is his slapdash
opinion. To
> me it appears that he is making simplistic statements about a
field he is
> currently studying. According to his website, he hasn’t been doing
> photography all that long, and yet here he is trying to analyze the
> vision of others.
>
> It has been my experience that good photographers dissemble
their views
> of the world around them. Most hold their best conversations
through
> their images. Through the Photoforum Gallery there is an
opportunity to
> read a photographer’s real intentions as there is no jurying
here. I feel
> that submitting work here has the potential for educating
others and
> displaying my shifting passions in photography. Some members here
> steadfastly refuse to see anything other than the obvious in
any of the
> images displayed, often including their own. Photography is
still an art
> where one has to read a photograph to discover the intention of its
> maker.
>
> During my life I have watched various photographers work in
their studios
> or on location and to be in the presence of art being created
is always a
> joy to behold even if the photographer is shooting something I
wouldn’t
> shoot. To whom am I referring? This is a partial list: Ansel
Adams, Dick
> Avedon, Arnold Newman, Steve Szabo, Eliot Erwitt, Andrew Davidhazy,
> Walker Evans, David Plowden, Jodi Cobb, Palma Allen, Ken Regan,
Howard
> Baker, Dvid Hume Kennerly, Dirck Halstead, David Burnett, Larry
Fink,
> John Eley, Len Rizzi, Patrice Gilbert, Dennis Brack, Paul
Conklin, Neil
> Liefer, and others too numerous to mention. I am no longer
young and what
> do I have to show for it? I have a certain vision of the world
and being
> a photographer has definitely widened my horizons.
>
> Rather than let Yoram slice up photographs he may not
understand, my
> suggestion would be that he save up some dough and take a trip
to Maine
> this summer for a workshop in photography on the topic of his
choice. The
> same is true for the others here who hack away at the
photographs like
> bad golfers. Learn more and think about what you’re going to
criticize
> before you do so. I rarely give a flying fig about criticism
and that is
> mostly because as noted I am no longer young and my skin is now
very
> thick. Before you begin a criticism with “Sorry, it is just
another...”
> try a little harder to imagine what creating something from
within takes,
> and then apply that thought to your own vision. I think Randy’s
shot this
> week shows incredible perception and great skill in just seeing
that
> scene with enough foresight to record it in all its glory. It’s
the kind
> of shot I’d like to see on LF film and also the kind of shot which
> diminishes the power of a NEX 7. It’s an image worthy of a
painter named
> Alfred Bierstadt.
>
>
> Jan
>
>
>
> On Mar 17, 2013, at 12:51 AM, YGelmanPhoto wrote:
>
>
>> This week's collection is much more eclectic than usual --
probably due
>> to the scramble to get something in after being told than
Nothing was
>> in the pot! Anyway, here's my take. -yoram
>>
>>
>>
>> On Mar 16, 2013, at 1:24 PM, Andrew Davidhazy wrote:
>>
>>
>>> The PhotoForum members' gallery/exhibit space was updated
March 16,
>>> 2013. Authors with work now on display at:
>>> http://people.rit.edu/andpph/gallery.html include:
>>>
>>>
>>> Andrew Sharpe - Bixby Park, Palo Alto, California
>>>
>> I don't understand what I'm looking at.
>>
>>
>>> Emily L. Ferguson - Reaching
>>>
>> The tree is strong but it's just standing there -- not
participating in
>> anything. . . like a sailboat race perhaps??
>>
>>> Yoram Gelman - Tracks Over Hill
>>>
>> My own . . . I see I overdid the vignetting in the sky.
>>
>>
>>> Art Faul -
>>>
>> Sorry, to me it is another car with a composited pattern.
>>
>>
>>> John Palcewski - Round Two
>>>
>> At first, it's an interesting dynamic with the sparse audience
staring
>> at the woman while the trainer seems to be looking for help.
But the
>> graphic behind the number '2' on the sign makes it a junk
photo for me.
>> And don't try telling me it's a silhouette of a boxing glove.
>>
>>
>>> Allan Rosen-Ducat -
>>>
>> I guess you could call it an abstract image. Saying that the
straight
>> line is a contrail does not add.
>>
>>> Randy Little -
>>>
>> The image is what it is. To me there had to be a lot of
"retouching".
>> The claim of "ZERO retouching only dodge and burn and and some
minor
>> CC" is self-contradictory.
>>
>>
>>> Christopher Strevens - my other hobby
>>>
>> This could be the only honest photo in the whole bunch this
week. My
>> eye is drawn to every device on the table, trying to figure it
out.
>> Extreme simplicity with complex overtones. (Sounds like I'm
trying to
>> describe some wine.)
>>
>>
>
>
> Art Faul
>
>
> The Artist Formerly Known as Prints
> ------
> Stills That Move: http://www.artfaul.com <http://www.artfaul.com/>
> Greens: http://www.inkjetprince.com <http://www.inkjetprince.com/>
> Camera Works - The Washington Post
>
http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-srv/photo/battlefieldparks/front_qt.htm
> ArtNet: http://www.artnet.com/artists/jan+w.-faul/
> art for cars: panowraps.com <http://panowraps.com/> .
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
Art Faul
The Artist Formerly Known as Prints
------
Stills That Move: http://www.artfaul.com
Greens: http://www.inkjetprince.com
Camera Works - The Washington Post
http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-srv/photo/battlefieldparks/front_qt.htm
ArtNet: http://www.artnet.com/artists/jan+w.-faul/
art for cars: panowraps.com <http://panowraps.com>
.
Art Faul
The Artist Formerly Known as Prints ------ Camera Works - The Washington Post .
|
