On 10/30/2016 12:15 AM, Samuel Williams wrote:
Adrian, I like the idea of teaching the appropriate SQL to achieve the
same thing. It makes a lot of sense, it's a pity the majority of
documentation doesn't do this.
John, if you read my earlier email you'd see that I proposed including
deprecation notices and aliasing the commands. I appreciate the need
for existing documentation to continue being relevant.
Melvin, I think you are blowing things out of proportion. I didn't
propose to rename the commands entirely such as "createuser" to
"prepareaccount". But, I think having "pg_createuser" or, preferrably,
"pg createuser". It's tidier, respectful of a limited global namespace
of command names, and potentially easier for everyone.
Gavin, I appreciate this is a low priority. But I think it's also
really easy to do by someone who is experienced. Perhaps a day or two
of work? So, it's low priority but also not that difficult and it's an
opportunity to improve the command line experience in a very
fundamental way for new users and experienced users alike.
In my mind, making Postgresql approachable by new users should be a
high priority.
A given the number of new users I see showing up and the number of those
using a GUI like pgAdmin I am not seeing the priority.
What it comes down to is adapting to your environment. In my day job I
work in a variety of different disciplines(plumbing, electrical,
equipment control, landscaping and so on) and I run into this context
shift all the time. In a perfect world everyone would agree on a common
way of doing things. This is not a perfect world so I have to adapt when
I move from one field to another and even within a field when dealing
with different people. I used to fight this, and still do when provoked,
but at some time point I realized I generally expended less energy just
learning 'the way' and getting on with my job. Not to say you do not
have some valid points, but you are pushing against something that has
significant inertia.
This is really just my 2c, I'd be happy to submit a PR but can you
confirm intention to work on it to acceptance? Otherwise I'm just
wasting everyone's time including my own :)
I do not see anyone pre-approving a PR that they have not seen.
On 30 October 2016 at 13:31, Gavin Flower <GavinFlower@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx> wrote:
On 30/10/16 11:25, John R Pierce wrote:
On 10/29/2016 3:02 PM, Samuel Williams wrote:
FYI,https://wiki.archlinux.org/index.php/PostgreSQL mentions initdb,
createuser, createdb and several others. I think my suggestion is
still relevant and something that would improve the system for new
users
and it would break it for the existing community that has up to 20 years
of experience with it, as well as breaking virtually all existing
documentation, books, howto articles, etc, including the one you linked.
I think it would be good to have all the postgresql utilities prefixed by
pg_ to keep them together, but have aliases so existing scripts &
documentation (especially 3rd party) were still relevant.
However, I wouldn't consider it the highest priority.
Cheers,
Gavin
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Adrian Klaver
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