as a followup to my earlier post about writing a kernel newbies column for linux.com, i'm hoping to use this mailing list to ask the occasional question for someone to clarify when, quite simply, i don't have the time since i have about eight things on the go right now and it would be ever so convenient if others decided to dig into some of the more arcane details that i'd add to a future piece. right now, i'm trying to clarify what you can and can't do with a module that's been loaded and marked as "[permanent]". as i read it (can't remember where now), if you manually load a module that has no registered module_exit() routine, that module will show under "lsmod" as "[permanent]" and is no longer unloadable. you can see that from this snippet from kernel/module.c in the print_unload_info() routine: if (mod->init != NULL && mod->exit == NULL) { printed_something = 1; seq_printf(m, "[permanent],"); } i did test that with a trivial module and, sure enough, that's how lsmod displayed it, and trying to unload it normally with "rmmod" told me it was busy (even though no one else was using it). fair enough. but is that the whole story? i did this under a running kernel that did *not* support forced module unloading, so the obvious thing would be to configure, build and reboot under that new kernel and test again with "rmmod -f" but, as i said, i just have too much to do today so if someone else wanted a puzzle to solve, by all means, test it and let us know what happens. in short, when you load a module like that, is it now really and truly unloadable until you reboot the system? rday p.s. from that code in kernel/module.c, it looks like having an init() routine but no exit() routine is the *only* thing that labels a loaded module as permanent. just an observation. -- ======================================================================== Robert P. J. Day Waterloo, Ontario, CANADA Linux Consulting, Training and Annoying Kernel Pedantry. Web page: http://crashcourse.ca Linked In: http://www.linkedin.com/in/rpjday Twitter: http://twitter.com/rpjday ======================================================================== -- To unsubscribe from this list: send an email with "unsubscribe kernelnewbies" to ecartis@xxxxxxxxxxxx Please read the FAQ at http://kernelnewbies.org/FAQ