I apologize for the garbled message sent previously. I was typing on freedombox with key echo on and had awl sorts of transpositions and missing spaces. Tried to do another email and the same thing was happening. I have to use freedobox mail because somehow emails to me from this list and some others are bouncing on my Charter account. Turned off key echo and now everything seems to be fine; don't know if it was something in freedobox Key echo, my keyboard, or what. Admittedly I didn't spellcheck before sending but my spelling isn't THAT bad!!! I have a friend who suddenly can not log in as root. She can log in with her normal user password or with mine; I have an account on her box and maintain it for her. But logging in as root fails both from the console login prompt and with su; she doesn't appear to have sudo. I've checked that she's using the correct password and that caps lock is off. Does anybody either have an idea what might have caused this or how we can solve the problem so she can log in as root? She can't fetch packages because she's using root to start her ppp connection. She hasn't upgraded for a while so it's not some new package she added causing the problem. Thanks for any help and sorry again about the last post; I checked it this time but now i'm paranoid!!! -- Email services by FreedomBox. Surf the Net at the sound of your voice. www.freedombox.info