On Mon, Dec 11, 2006 at 04:28:32AM +0100, Esben Stien wrote: > Fons Adriaensen <fons@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx> writes: > > > To compare this to the skills of a gamer seems a joke to me. > > I disagree wholeheartedly;). As a die hard free software first person > action gamer, I find what I do to be an art; just as my jujutsu is an > art, which is not just about hitting someone in the head. Concerning the game playing, I'd agree that there may be more involved than the ability to push buttons. But assuming for a moment there is something in there that is a bonus to humanity, as art is, I wonder why it can apparently be expressed only in a context of violence and killing, and in a simplistic mindset consisting of 'good' and 'evil'. You don't find this lack of subtlety in oriental martial arts - they are about more than the technicalities of hurting someone efficiently. They also train your mind and personality, and teach restraint rather than indiscriminate violence. Here again we have two things that can't be compared. IMHO, all art, using the word in the usual sense, touches on ambiguity, the complexities of the human condition, and things that escape the framework of rational thinking. Not that it's supposed to express any of these in any way - certainly music isn't, even if it is often interpreted as such. -- FA Lascia la spina, cogli la rosa.