On Tue, 2004-11-30 at 13:20, Marek Peteraj wrote: > On Tue, 2004-11-30 at 03:17, Mark Knecht wrote: > > On Tue, 30 Nov 2004 19:42:32 -0600, Ryan Gallagher > > <ruinaudio@xxxxxxxxxxx> wrote: > > > On Tue, 2004-11-30 at 00:55 +0100, Marek Peteraj wrote: > > > > On Tue, 2004-11-30 at 20:14, Ryan Gallagher wrote: > > > > Linux users are still a minority and linux audio users > > > > > an even smaller one, downright miniscule. We should try to stay "real" > > > > > in estimating our tiny presence in this huge industry. > > > > > > > > Ok let's get this straight. ;) > > > > > > > > (why do we always underestimate ourselves) > > > > > > Come on... reality check. The mail lists for > > > Avid->DigiDesign->Pro-Tools alone dwarf LAU. > > > > I'm pretty sure that the PTLE list for only x86 hardware, which is > > probably closer to what 90% of LAU users are trying to do, dwarfs LAU. > > Add in Mac PTLE users and it probably doubles or possibly triples. > > After that the big boys are incremental. There are certainly fewer of > > them, but you can pretty much expect that there are 2 or 3 engineers > > at least from every Pro Tools based studio out there, and there are a > > lot of Pro Tools based studios. > > > > > > The linux-audio market isn't a fly-fart in sulfur mine to these 2nd tier > > > companies (m-audio et. al.). They're competing for crumbs from the > > > giant's (digidesign) lap anyway. > > > > > > > Suppose that each city and perhaps a fairly large town in the US and > > > > Europe has got at least *one* linux audio user. > > > > > > > > Likely? I think so :) > > > > > > > > How much users would that be? Hundreds? More? > > > > > > Hundreds. And the money we (LAU's) spend on audio gear in a year per > > > company wouldn't pay the salary of the person who pushes "send" on the > > > "we don't plan support" emails for a month. > > > > > > > Now let's look at the "tiny" linux audio market. Ask everyone what unit > > > > he has got. I bet it's going to be 2/3rd RME 1/3 Maudio. > > > > > > I'd venture to guess that if EVERY LAU signed a petition to support only > > > one company in return for drivers/support... it'd mean nothing. To be > > > honest, I'm grateful for any "support" official or otherwise we get. > > > IMO it's a cheritible act for these profit driven (not meant in a > > > negative way) manufacturers to spend/risk revenue on what is still > > > largely a hobby OS (speaking of linux desktop/audio here only). > > > > > > > > 1) second the validity of your statements regarding OS representation > > > > > (LAU is a pretty insular community, sometimes it feels bigger than it > > > > > is) > > > > > > > > Sadly it's exactly the opposite. > > > > > > Bottom line, these companies are not stupid. They know where the money > > > is, and it ain't on LAU. If it were, they'd be here too. > > > > > > > Yep...however the smart ones look for ways to both incrementally > > increase revenue, and then also to create revolutionary changes. I > > keep thinking that one of these days Digi will come out with a closed > > system that is Linux based and includes the PC itself. Incrementally > > it wouldn't cost them all that much to add a PC to some unit like the > > 002 Rack. Most users would use external audio drives so internal > > storage requiremments aren't that high. They'd have control of the OS > > and it would be stable. > > > > For the last 6 months PTLE users have been caught in a bind. No PTLE > > versions run on XP Service Pack 2 so all PTLE systems have to stick > > with a bad version of Windows that isn't getting updates. I'm scared > > to do much on the net with my PTLE machine. I don't know why Digi > > hasn't fixed this. I guess it's hard. The plugin vendors have told us > > their plugins aren't stable on SP2 either, so it's a mess. > > > > But before we totally discount the idea of LAU/Ardour type apps > > failing in comparison to Digi I'm reminded of when I wrote a post > > there and a couple of guys jumped up and started building Planet > > machines to try it out. Problem was it was too hard to build and > > Fernando wasn't supporting it yet. Today they would have a much easier > > time. For fun I answered a year old question in that thread and popped > > it back to the top of the list. > > > > http://duc.digidesign.com > > > > Look at the PTLE on Windows forum. > > > > FYI - There are 48700 registered users of the DigiDesign forums... > > So how big would the number of sold units be? I believe that a *lot* of > those customers had at least one problem, registered and asked on their > forums. Dobule or triple the number. > > The samller card manufacturers usually deal with smaller numbers. > > 1000 and growing is a very interesting number to me. > *sigh* Wish i was a card manufacturer. BTW, let's compare: Digi002 fw interface 8 analog i/o ProTools recording sw, plugin bundle, and perhaps other software tools 1199euro Fireface, 10 analog i/o no software (usually worth another 1000 euro) 1300euro No wonder there's 50.000 users on their forums. Marek
