On Dec 4, 2013, at 5:55 PM, <l.wood@xxxxxxxxxxxx> <l.wood@xxxxxxxxxxxx> wrote: > Where are these being discussed? It's a response to an IETF draft, ergo ietf@xxxxxxxx is entirely appropriate. That Perens doesn't submit it as an internet-draft in response just suggests lack of political nous. On the perpass mailing list. > Way to go on the selective quoting - I see you ignore the DRM point. Sheesh, you can't even give a pointer to the refutations you apparently cite. This too has been discussed. The point in the case of DRM is that while DRM is indeed, as you say, eminently breakable, breaking it is inconvenient. So putting DRM on everything increases costs for those who want to see the plaintext of everything. > Don't you have anything substantial to say yourself, other than snarky oneliners? I try not to repeat points that people smarter than I have already made, but I do take your point that this discussion is sufficiently widely splattered that nobody can possibly have followed every bit of it.