However, in several ways the Economist story is superior to the geek version of the story at http://www.theregister.co.uk/2013/11/08/watch_out_spooks_standards_groups_are_fighting_back/ (Also see the reader comments on that.) On Sat, Nov 9, 2013 at 4:26 PM, Tim Bray <tbray@xxxxxxxxxxxxxx> wrote: > [1]: > http://www.economist.com/news/science-and-technology/21589383-stung-revelations-ubiquitous-surveillance-and-compromised-software > > > On Fri, Nov 8, 2013 at 6:35 PM, Yoav Nir <ynir@xxxxxxxxxxxxxx> wrote: >> >> >> On Nov 8, 2013, at 3:03 PM, SM <sm@xxxxxxxxxxxx> wrote: >> >> > From the Economist [1]: >> > >> > "On November 6th a meeting in Vancouver of the Internet Engineering >> > Task Force (IETF), an organisation which brings together the >> > scientists, technicians and programmers who built the internet in >> > the first place and whose behind-the-scenes efforts keep it running, >> > debated what to do about all this. A strong streak of West Coast >> > libertarianism still runs through the IETF, and the tone was mostly >> > hostile to the idea of omnipresent surveillance. Some of its members >> > were involved in creating the parts of the internet that spooks are >> > now exploiting. "I think we should treat this as an attack," said >> > Stephen Farrell, a computer scientist from Trinity College, Dublin, >> > in his presentation to the delegates. Discussion then moved on to >> > what should be done to thwart it. >> > >> > As a sort of council of elders for the internet, the IETF has plenty >> > of soft power. But it has no formal authority. Because its standards >> > must be acceptable to users and engineers all over the world, it works >> > through a slow process of consensus-building. New standards, >> > guidelines >> > and advice take months or years to produce." >> > >> > There is a sort of council of elders of the internet around here. :-) >> >> And we are apparently delegates. >> >> Yoav >> >> >